Thor Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 1 minute ago, schwabbele said: @ThorHaha that does sound like fun What did you use as BL? Liberators x 2 and judicator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schwabbele Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 (edited) Thx, I might buy me one just to play this list, sounds super funny Wait, @Thor the Staunch Defender does also apply to the Model which has the trait? Edited August 22, 2018 by schwabbele Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 1 hour ago, schwabbele said: Thx, I might buy me one just to play this list, sounds super funny Wait, @Thor the Staunch Defender does also apply to the Model which has the trait? Yes it does Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeaeaene Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 I also really enjoyed the Throne of Skulls in Düsseldorf. Had a Lot of fun with my four-ballistas-and-an-ordinator-party-block. Dropping such a thing in the back of an opponent forced him to turn back and so away from the mission objectives. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Namelessone81 Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 16 minutes ago, Daeaeaene said: I also really enjoyed the Throne of Skulls in Düsseldorf. Had a Lot of fun with my four-ballistas-and-an-ordinator-party-block. Dropping such a thing in the back of an opponent forced him to turn back and so away from the mission objectives. Can 4 barista be holy within 9’’ of the ordinator? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeaeaene Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Ohhh yes ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeaeaene Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 12 minutes ago, Namelessone81 said: Can 4 barista be holy within 9’’ of the ordinator? Ohhh yes ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughwyeth Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 58 minutes ago, Namelessone81 said: Can 4 barista be holy within 9’’ of the ordinator? If the baristas stay within 9" for another turn, you get flat whites for free too. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Williams Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 18 minutes ago, hughwyeth said: If the baristas stay within 9" for another turn, you get flat whites for free too. Do they have fluffies too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughwyeth Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 23 minutes ago, Mark Williams said: Do they have fluffies too? No I don't think so, FAQ didn't mention anything. Here's a simple illustration: Turn 1: Turn 2: 6 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeaeaene Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 14 minutes ago, hughwyeth said: No I don't think so, FAQ didn't mention anything. Here's a simple illustration: Turn 1: Turn 2: Those tactics are not my cup of tea ? 4 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Blade Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Concerning a Lord Castellant's warding lantern, does rolling 7+ on my save, do those rolls negate damage on saves that failed and mortals inflicted in the same combat? Sorry if this has been asked before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Blade Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Celestial VindicatorsLeadersLord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (240)- General- Trait: Single-minded Fury - Spell: Thundershock- Mount Trait: Aethereal StalkerLord-Castellant (100)- Artefact: Stormrage Blade Knight-Incantor (140)- Spell: Lighntning BlastBattleline20 x Sequitors (400)- Tempest Blades and Soulshields- 9x Stormsmite Greatmaces5 x Judicators (160)- Skybolt Bows- 1x Shockbolt Bows5 x Judicators (160)- Skybolt Bows- 1x Shockbolt BowsUnits3 x Evocators on Dracolines (300)- 2x Grandstaves- Lore of Invigoration: Celestial Blades5 x Evocators (200)- 5x Grandstaves- Lore of Invigoration: Speed of Lightning2 x Fulminators (240)Endless SpellsChronomantic Cogs (60)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 118 I'm about to take on a Deep-kin player who fields an Idolon Aspect of the sea and The High King special character, typically right next to each other and I am unsure of how I should engage him. He will be using the anti charging enclave rules and has a tanky 6 eel unit rerolling 1s on a 2+ save that is in the shadow of that turtle. These three elements of his list I am unaware of how I should deal with these issues with the tools I have at my disposal. Any help would be appreciated thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJetski Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 1 hour ago, Black Blade said: Concerning a Lord Castellant's warding lantern, does rolling 7+ on my save, do those rolls negate damage on saves that failed and mortals inflicted in the same combat? Sorry if this has been asked before. Rolling to ignore damage is not the same thing as a save roll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Blade Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, PJetski said: Rolling to ignore damage is not the same thing as a save roll. I know that, the lantern gives me +1 to my save and on a 7+ they heal 1 damage. I'm asking if that healing negates damage taken in the same combat. Like if I failed 3 saves but also got 3, 6's is it a wash or do I lose 1 liberator and heal a wound on the 1 left over? Edited August 22, 2018 by Black Blade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gottkaiser Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 The way I understand it, they would cancel each other out, so if you fail 3 Saves and roll 3 times 7+, none of your guys gets hurt. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schwabbele Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Don‘t think so ,it says wounds allocated. As i understand it you could only heal up already allocated wounds , not the ones you are about to receive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 In the old FAQ it was stated as healing first, then lose wounds from failed saves. Just now, schwabbele said: Don‘t think so ,it says wounds allocated. As i understand it you could only heal up already allocated wounds , not the ones you are about to receive. What he said! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Williams Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Wouldn’t choosing to roll them one at a time solve the problem? You allocate 1 wound, then roll saves one after another, healing the wound in the case of a 6, allocating another when you fail? That seems like the most fair thing to do to me. Bit slow, but fair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amysrevenge Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 To quote a certain rules writer: "What do the words say?" If we look at page 7 (in my digital version) of the rules, in the Making Attacks box, the steps of an attack go Hit Roll, Wound Roll, Save Roll, Determine Damage. It is at the Save Roll step that the healing applies. It is not until after all of the attacking for a unit is finished, that we get to the Allocating Wounds step, at which time the accrued Damage is turned into Wounds. (Double checking the Lord-Castellant rule, there's nothing in there about changing the timing.) This is an order of operations that most of us (myself included) get wrong all the time, because it almost never matters. But the wounds don't get allocated until after all the attacking is done, not on an attack-by-attack basis. Damage accumulates, but it doesn't turn into wounds until the unit is finished. (It's another place where there aren't enough words, similar to how they fixed moving by adding "normal move" to the game - we use the "To Wound" roll to determine if we do damage, not if we do wounds. It's frustrating.) So, here's where it all comes out for the Lord-Castellant: The healing all happens in the middle of the attack sequence - after the attacks occur, but before any damage is allocated. It would not be a useful ability at all if there were any 1W Stormcast models (there aren't). It is of extremely limited usefulness for 2W models, as you can only ever heal 1W per attacking unit, if there was a model with 1W remaining at the start of that attacking unit's activation. It is a much more useful ability for 3+W models, especially heroes (and especially especially stardrakes with that big pot of wounds). Would also do a fine job on Ballistas... 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Williams Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 My interpretation of the rules is that attacks happen one at a time. Each attack represents a sequence of events, happening one after the other. You only combine rolls together if it doesn’t affect the outcome. However the lord castellant affects the outcome and forces you to resolve them one at a time. The book to me clear indicates this is how you do it. example 1: I have a hero with no wounds, you do 5 wounds. Roll 5 dice in sequence. 6 (healing effect ignored, save made) 1 (failed save, 1 wound allocated) 3 (save passed) 6 (save passed, 1 wound healed) 2 ( save failed, 1 wound allocated) End result: 1 wound taken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amysrevenge Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 (edited) I get that you'd like for it to be that way. But the Allocating Wounds section is pretty unambiguous. Wounds don't get allocated until after all of a unit's attacks have been resolved, through the Hit/Wound/Save/Damage sequence. Quote Once all of a unit's attacks have been resolved, add up the damage that was inflicted. The player commanding the target unit must then allocate a number of wounds to the target unit equal to the damage that was inflicted. You're long past the point of rolling Saves (and healing, in this case) by the time you allocate any wounds to a model. Edit to add: In like 99.9% of cases it makes no difference, so the way it universally gets played is that damage = wounds instantly on an attack-by-attack basis. But it's not accurate to do it that way. Edited August 22, 2018 by amysrevenge More to say... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Williams Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 (edited) Edit: I see what you are saying now. I was under the impression that attacks were resolved one at a time, and that damage was allocated before moving on to the next attack. So basically what you are saying is that the only way the heal triggers is if a unit or model starts with a wound existing at the time saves are made for one group of attacks against it. Example, a unit of liberators with 1 wound remaining. Attacks are made, save rules are made. 3 6s are rolled for but 3 wounds are allocated. The initial wound is healed, then 3 wounds are allocated - 1 lib dies, 1 remains with 1 wound. Edited August 22, 2018 by Mark Williams 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amysrevenge Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 (edited) Here's the problem. "Resolving" an attack doesn't end up putting any wounds on a target. They key part is this: "Once all of a unit's attacks have been resolved". Whether you resolve them one at a time, or all at once, you don't allocate any wounds until the unit (not the model, not the weapon profile, not the single attack sequence) is finished all of its attacks. You get to the point of Damage right away, one attack at a time. You don't get to Wounds until all of the attacks for a unit are done. ETA: This isn't a unique thing for Multiple Attacks. This is the only place that tells how to allocate wounds. Edited August 22, 2018 by amysrevenge 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schwabbele Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 How would SCE tackle a death army with Nagash , 2 other heros which can revive models and 2 40er unit skeletons and 30 from those reapers? Killing the blobs should not be an issue for evos or sequitors, however that CA which allows them to 100% re-spawn a whole unit is kinda meh. Deep-striking Nagash works only in theory now, killing the other 2 heros could work via an deep-strike but will only hinder their unit restocking . Another thing which really annoys me, is that we basically have to field blobs too, charging those 40er skeleton units with our "elite" mini units is suicide and will also not work for model count objectives. What are your thoughts / experiences with on this topic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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