Malakithe Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 5 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said: Flamekeeper - 80pts Auric Hearthguard - 120pts (-5) Hearthguard Berzerkers - 135pts (+10) Dual Handaxe Vulkites - 160 Slingshield Vulkites - 170 (+10) So...still complete ******. And AHG are basically useless now. Why reduce the ward range from 10" to 9"? These points dont make much sense and doesnt give me much hope that GW will fix droths or our heroes at all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azamar Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 24 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said: Flamekeeper - 80pts Auric Hearthguard - 120pts (-5) Hearthguard Berzerkers - 135pts (+10) Dual Handaxe Vulkites - 160 Slingshield Vulkites - 170 (+10) 80 points for the flamekeeper might help him see some use. Ouch on the rest but the hearthguard berserker increase was long overdue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmac Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 18 minutes ago, Malakithe said: So...still complete ******. And AHG are basically useless now. Why reduce the ward range from 10" to 9"? These points dont make much sense and doesnt give me much hope that GW will fix droths or our heroes at all. Looks to me they did what I was afraid of, undoing the nerfs to throwing axes and then nerfing everything to compensate for the ranged damage being mostly incidental instead of completely meaningless. It definitely reads as changes by someone with no understanding of the army either way. Twin Axes were already the worse option, losing re-roll all hits for a conditional +1 attack is a massive nerf for them on a unit that was already basically useless. Auric HG have no role at all now. No bodyguard, no anti-monster, bad shooting. Why bring them at all? The new hero is worse than anyone could have guessed, sure he's 80 points but he's 80 points because he does nothing. Shield Vulkites may be playable now as meatshields, but that's not exactly an exciting change, especially when everything else is looking worse than ever. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clan's Cynic Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) The whole thing definitely screams the writer overestimating the impact of the Throwing Axes buff. Flamekeeper at 80 might see him slide into some lists as a, "well I don't have anything else to take" option but him not being a Priest is really baffling just thematically. Aurics were undeniably nerfed and I genuinely don't know why. I could see the writer panicking that in a Monster-themed meta they didn't want a unit to very specifically benefit against Monsters or something? Maybe it'll become a Lofnir gimmick in the new Battletome. As for why they lost Sworn Protector... I got nothing because even in the fluff they're... well, sworn protectors. Still being 4+ to hit is also a pity. There's pretty much no reason to take them now unless you want a bit more visual diversity. Vulkites were obviously dominating the meta and clearly needed the Dual Handaxe nerf. Slingshields just giving a 4+ Save is obviously better than the convoluted "stay still and get +1 to melee attack Saves" but I don't think it was worth a 10pt increase. Edited January 15, 2022 by Clan's Cynic 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scheppi Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) Im a huge fan of dwarven forces, so i was realy exited about the new Box set releas and totaly jumped on the Fyreslayers hype train, bought my first Start-Collecting box to start my army. Now seeing those changes, I totaly lost my motivation and vision for my FS army. I was following the Rumors and FS Thread silently for a while now, and i was always in a positiv mind set, didnt want to support the negative whiny posts. I was hoping the best for FS Its not like i was expecting to play a 10/10 S-Tier army or somthing like that, but i wanted to get SOME unit variation in my Army, because i didnt want to spam only HGB and call it a day. So unit variation at FS means like... 3 "different" units, that look basically the same. Im not complaining about the aesthetics of FS, no...im complaining, that the new changes make some of those 3 units even less viable than before, now i dont even feel like playing AHG HGB and VB all together I realy hope, that those changes are just temporarily, otherwise my FS-Army project is probably canceled. If theres a new Batteltome coming, it hopefully lets my dream come true, realy want those stubborn dwarves Edited January 15, 2022 by Scheppi 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonesplitterz Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) 55 minutes ago, Scheppi said: So unit variation at FS means like... 3 "different" units, that look basically the same. We now have 33% more units warscrolls ! ...Vulkite are two warscrolls now 🤬 Edited January 15, 2022 by Bonesplitterz 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakithe Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 Yeah AHG and dual axe vulkites are dead and wont see use even more so now then before. And the points...come on. Im legit baffled...i cant even begin to wrap my head around the stupid decision making the rules writers make. My guess is no one at GW actually plays their own games or are part of any communities. And they definitely dont have playtesters to check this ******. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doko Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) So...what can be said.......we were a middle tier or botton tier and we got nerfed every unit? The new hero is 100% useless,a situational buff and nothimg more. The ranged hearthguard lost the double damage vs monsters and nerfed from halves mov to only-1 ohhh and now also lost the bodyguard.........a unit with 3'5 damage ratio and cost 130 but reavers in same box with 170 points have 8'8 damage and 11 damage at 9"...... Melle hearthguard nerfed in points and lost 6+++ without hero and also changed from within 10" to wholy within 9" doing it allmost imposible to play getting 15 30 bases in melle and in wholy within 9 of a hero Vulkites have 30 base and 1" range so they are useless What can be said?i really i cant be more dissapointed at the point of cancell my order of 2of this box and sell my fs army. I was hoping that a army with only 3 units after 7 years would get some new unit but we got 0 I was hoping a army that data show as middle\botton tier got some buff but we got huge nerfs in every unit. Its dont make sense Edited January 15, 2022 by Doko 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakithe Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 4 minutes ago, Doko said: sell my fs army. Yeah...im with you here. Im waiting till the next book to see what happens but if the book turns out as bad as this then im done with Fyreslayers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beliman Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 There are a some nice things with that nerf too. Some people are already selling their armies and I bought half of the new box for 55 euros. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doko Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 If you are in spain i can sell you my army at 50% of store price 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmac Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 50 minutes ago, Malakithe said: Yeah...im with you here. Im waiting till the next book to see what happens but if the book turns out as bad as this then im done with Fyreslayers Yeah, this is bad beyond comprehension. Every unit hard nerfed without exception, wtf? Even the new hero is...let me put it this way-He's 85 points with decent combat stats. That means even GW knew he was basically useless when pointing him, which means the feedback from testers must have been absolutely terrible, but they proceeded anyway without bothering to rework such an obviously flawed warscroll. I was looking forward to dusting off my Fyreslayers, maybe painting up a few more models etc, but somehow I don't think that's going to happen now. I can honestly only think of two explanations for every unit in the army being treated this bad, either: 1. Bonesplittered, deliberately nerfed down to irrelevance as part of a soup army they don't actually want anyone to play, or 2. Actually getting new units, so they needed to make the old stuff look bad. I don't believe that at this point, so I'm sticking with theory#1 until otherwise proven. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonesplitterz Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 17 minutes ago, madmac said: I can honestly only think of two explanations for every unit in the army being treated this bad, either: 1. Bonesplittered, deliberately nerfed down to irrelevance as part of a soup army they don't actually want anyone to play, or 2. Actually getting new units, so they needed to make the old stuff look bad. I don't believe that at this point, so I'm sticking with theory#1 until otherwise proven. I play Bonesplittez and Fyreslayers so I hear ya 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmac Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 5 minutes ago, Bonesplitterz said: I play Bonesplittez and Fyreslayers so I hear ya I was putting the finishing touches on my Bonesplitterz when the new Warclan came out, sad fist bump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJetski Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 I guess it wasn't enough that Fyreslayers were the least played army with the lowest kit diversity... Maybe Magmadroths are going to be good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doko Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 Magmadroths need be at gargants or maw krushas or leviadon level to try balance these scrolls Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJetski Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) On 1/13/2022 at 4:44 PM, Beliman said: Warhammer Community talks about them as "fiery funerary priests". lol 7 hours ago, Clan's Cynic said: Slingshield Vulkites - 170 (+10) 1 attack per model on 10man squad with 32mm bases and 1" range... for 170 points This is so bad Edited January 15, 2022 by PJetski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmac Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 9 minutes ago, PJetski said: lol 1 attack per model on 10man squad with 32mm bases and 1" range... for 170 points This is so bad literally compare them to Ardboyz, same price for 10 models, slightly less bravery, same wounds, same saves, three times as many attacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robotnik_taco Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) So slaanesh, bonesplitterz, and now potentially this...... I hate the idea of a community or tournament comp but maybe getting the ITC involved and just completely rejecting a battletome for matched play and using the previous one might be a cool idea. Imagine how happy bonesplitterz players would be with their old rules back? Have every fyreslayer player just refuse the new battletome if it's hot garbo Edited January 15, 2022 by robotnik_taco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doko Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 Yes vulkites with pick are the biggest joke of all aos rigth now. I dont get how one person get paid for this level of work. Is imposible someone that have a fraction of knowledge about aos units put a unit with 1" range 30 base and 10 atk 4\3\1\1 a cost of 170 when units of 100 points have same stats(my omw army longbeards with two hands have 10 atk 3\3\1\1 that is better than vulkites and moreover buff aoe a reroll wound of 1 and cost 70 points less) And for me the worst are hearthguards melle,points allway can change but we gonna be stuck with these scrolls for 3+ years and to me play getting them at Wholy within 9" is a pain and gonna make my plays a pain to play ant not fun. Rigth now many times i got them out of wholy within 12" of some auras many times due to have huge base and betwen charge and pile in my foot hero is too far away and new 9" gonna be imposible in many situations and now we lost even the 6+++ without hero. And the hearthguard rangued........who was paid for think that a unit of 120 points can have a damage output of 3'3!!!! Damage????and that is broken so must get removed the bodyguard and the double damage to monsters,again even my irondrakes moving or with enemys in melle have more damage. Hearthguard even with 2 shoots per model wouldnt be so good but 3'3 damage for 120 and nothing extra is a joke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baron Klatz Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) Well Flamekeeper at 80 is the cheapness I was hoping for to spam them in a procession. The non-priest thing is super weird though and I can’t help but think it’s an oversight like the Sloggoth which wasn’t even a Kruleboy at release that they fixed later. Whole thing definitely smacks of the nerf-bat adjustments they’re making for a upcoming battletome and this is just an incomplete piece of the puzzle. Time will tell and hopefully the monster-focus means Magmadroths and maybe even new units rumored(accurate guy said 2) can shine.(and at the very very least we won’t hear “they weren’t selling so they made them OP to move stock” complaints ) Edit: I’m also wondering how much the scenario book is favoring Fyreslayers as defenders with these rules since they’re fighting on their own turf in the Realm of Fire. That could indirectly help them too if the new Season of War switches to Aqshy. Edited January 15, 2022 by Baron Klatz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beliman Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 4 hours ago, Doko said: If you are in spain i can sell you my army at 50% of store price Yes, I live in spain. I'm still interested in buying a few things. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clan's Cynic Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 hour ago, Baron Klatz said: Well Flamekeeper at 80 is the cheapness I was hoping for to spam them in a procession. The non-priest thing is super weird though and I can’t help but think it’s an oversight like the Sloggoth which wasn’t even a Kruleboy at release that they fixed later. All I can think is they didn't want to have to print out a separate card/page of Prayers and he'll get the keyword in the actual Battletome? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baron Klatz Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 hour ago, Clan's Cynic said: All I can think is they didn't want to have to print out a separate card/page of Prayers and he'll get the keyword in the actual Battletome? That’s a good point for a possibility. Others are saying it might also be their watered down separate release strategy like how kits just give you simplified data sheet cards instead of full warscrolls. This all could be contained to the box to spice up the fights. So things could be radically different for the tomes. speaking of which, 3.0 battletomes seem to love army-wide effects. What do you guys figure Fyreslayers can get out of that? Being an army that’s usually covered in fire or magma I hope it’s more exciting than wards(though that could fit with the rune tattoos) and they cause a heat-wave debuff to enemies they fight. Opposite to the wards & diseases of Maggotkin as Fyreslayers soften you up with sling shields, slowing magma bolts and heatstroke so their charge can smash an enemy’s defense to pieces or make them regret fighting Fyreslayers on the defensive as the losses make them stronger(Flamekeepers here) and keep the enemy down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doko Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 We need some as every wound done and not saved makes 1 extra mortal wound due to magma weapons to do even some playable these bad scrolls. And these are 100% the scrolls of our tome with 0 changes as were the cards of dominion or dok vs slanesh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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