The Rumour Thread

[Nazarjo]

9 minutes ago, Captaniser said:

Oof

Very sad that this probably means we aren't getting the new FEC stuff for a while, or that they won't actually get a range refresh

[Chikout]

It's a very good looking book not as a rules set but as a product. 70 pages of lore a good painting section with nice examples of each city and a lot of fantastic art. I'm buying this book for sure.

As for the rules, I don't agree with a lot of the complaints. Most of the Aelf warscrolls have been buffed considerably since the last edition. Executioners got double the number of attacks and do 2 mortals on sixes now. A power pair of a sorceress and black guard are pretty tanky now. The drakespawn knights have a much improved profile and the chariots are solid. 

The battleline is nothing special but I don't mind that. 

The dark riders are good fast chaff that gained a useful ability. 

The hydra is good. 

A human gunline with Aelf support definitely feels like a viable army now. 

[Freemeta]

i agree but i'm not sure about point cost for executionner (170) and some other like gyrobomber (120).

yeah it was a good surprise to see old stuff being a little better baseline.

[dekay]

9 minutes ago, Chikout said:

A human gunline with Aelf support definitely feels like a viable army now. 

I haven't thoroughly read the full list of buffs available for Cavaliers, but at the first  glance, drakespawn knights might be even slightly better? They have worse hitting power on the charge but in subsequent turns it almost evens out, they have inbuilt +1 to charge range and a free reroll when dreadlord is around, they're  significantly cheaper and their lances have range 2, plus access to strike first from the Aelf order. Plus, they buff drakespawn chariots that are solid on their own.

No matter what synergies there are for the cavaliers, drakespawn seem like a valid alternative.

Basic darkling infantry seems like a mistake, though. No idea if they have any uses.

[Gitzdee]

1 hour ago, Ragest said:

I'm  the other side of the stick, as new CoS player I'm very happy that I can play with just humans (even more, juat new models) without the feeling of losing something for ignoring old models.

 

I hope the next wave is just a Human army, with the dark elves goint to Malerion and Dispossesed to unified duardin book/new duardin faction.

This Whitefang like could confirm something or just be a like.

Edit: I would really like a new Dispossessed book. Insta buy for me without even seeing any new minis.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Gitzdee

[Asbestress]

34 minutes ago, Captaniser said:

Oof

Interesting. I still think army set is coming in early-mid September/hoping for mid-late August 😛

Now that we "know" that Epic most likely got delayed because of something with the core book (most likely poor proof-reading/rules quality as that's what I've mostly heard), do we think this might bring some early Fall releases forward to fill the large, enormous, gaping, etc. hole left by it?

I am in no way theorizing about this due to my terminal hype for the Cities release which has slowly been wracking my body both physically and mentally since the announcement last May, and thus hoping for the Army Set to release before Summer's over and life picks up again.

[Goatforce]

Well we know that full army releases are a month or 2 after the army box, so November for the full army isn't too suprising, if September is the box. Maybe FEC will be sandwiched between the box and full army release? Or perhaps the CoS release is early November and FEC is later? In which case November will be a busy AoS month!

[madmac]

I think the non-human side of things has a clear divide, the aelf stuff is mostly still pretty good, while the dispossessed stuff is mostly awful now. I don't believe it was part of some master plan though, that's just how things worked out. Either way the fact that things are even more heavily keyword locked than in the previous tome means that the non-human pieces of the book who both have way fewer synergies and options period need to overperform a little on their warscrolls just to even keep pace with the Human side of the book which has huge buffs and synergies spilling out everywhere.

I'm undecided on how I feel about the new tome overall right now. It has some neat stuff, but it's very very different than the previous book and as such lost a lot of what made that book special and unique. It's a much smaller feeling book than the last tome, on multiple levels, and while I think it will be very strong mechanically it doesn't have the same charms, IMO.

[Azamar]

26 minutes ago, Chikout said:

It's a very good looking book not as a rules set but as a product. 70 pages of lore a good painting section with nice examples of each city and a lot of fantastic art. I'm buying this book for sure.

As for the rules, I don't agree with a lot of the complaints. Most of the Aelf warscrolls have been buffed considerably since the last edition. Executioners got double the number of attacks and do 2 mortals on sixes now. A power pair of a sorceress and black guard are pretty tanky now. The drakespawn knights have a much improved profile and the chariots are solid. 

The battleline is nothing special but I don't mind that. 

The dark riders are good fast chaff that gained a useful ability. 

The hydra is good. 

A human gunline with Aelf support definitely feels like a viable army now. 

I’m with you on that one. There’s definitely been some good buffs for aelves and the dispossessed units aren’t bad either (the warden kings old command ability going is countered by the extra rend and attacks or damage they get as standard). 
 

Really the only downside is most abilities are species locked, which is a shame, although if you took all the buffs you can put on fusiliers and could put them instead on Irondrakes, you’d never bother with fusiliers.

oh and darkling battleline do have a use. The sorceresses have to stab *someone* before casting!

[RyantheFett]

Looking at the leaks it's pretty clear that this is three different armies and will at some point be split.

Sad that one of the coolest ideas GW had feels like it is on life support for a watered down Imperium 2.0. At least we have years before they can remove all the nonhuman stuff.

Sort of love that it goes with the joke GW has no idea what they are doing, but will always make bank lol. I just feel sorry for the more casual fans that think Cities will get nonhuman waves in the future.

Edited August 5, 2023 by RyantheFett
spelling

[Ejecutor]

1 hour ago, Captaniser said:

Oof

The book says Dec 23

[Clan's Cynic]

16 minutes ago, RyantheFett said:

Sort of love that it goes with the GW has no idea what they are doing, but will make bank lol. I just feel sorry for the more casual fans that think Cities will get nonhuman waves in the future.

I think the most damning sign is that I can't find a piece of new art which includes Duardin or Aelves anywhere, certainly none alongside art of the new Freeguild models.

The presence of non-Dark Elves also seems to have been quietly retconned, with the implication that the only Elves who live in the Cities are all insular, untrustworthy (for an elf) and of questionable character because they're either in with the Covens or Privateers.

I think we all expect the Dark Elves to get the chop whenever Malerion comes around, but the Dispossessed are going to be the wildcard. Interestingly, there is another reference to Grombrindal being out and about as being sent by Grungni. That's not new, but nice to see brought up again. 

 

[Chikout]

12 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

I think the most damning sign is that I can't find a piece of new art which includes Duardin or Aelves anywhere, certainly none alongside art of the new Freeguild models.

The presence of non-Dark Elves also seems to have been quietly retconned, with the implication that the only Elves who live in the Cities are all insular, untrustworthy (for an elf) and of questionable character because they're either in with the Covens or Privateers.

I think we all expect the Dark Elves to get the chop whenever Malerion comes around, but the Dispossessed are going to be the wildcard. Interestingly, there is another reference to Grombrindal being out and about as being sent by Grungni. That's not new, but nice to see brought up again. 

 

I think everyone's being a little too negative about this. New art is commissioned to show off new models. I had a look through the Seraphon book. There isn't a single piece of new art that shows a stegadon, a bastilidon or a trogladon. I'm pretty sure that doesn't mean that those units are disappearing. 

This new range of humans exists because people have been asking for it for ages. Don't forget that the sculpting on this range was completed two or more years ago. Go back and look at two year old posts on this forum. Did anyone start asking for mixed units before GW's announcement last year? I don't remember it. 

People at GW read this forum. They are a company that reacts to the desires of the community. It just happens slowly.  

The higher ups make bad business decisions like no digital battletomes all the time but when it comes to the design team, they frequently follow the desires of the community, albeit with their own spin at times. 

[Aleser]

3 minutes ago, Chikout said:

I think everyone's being a little too negative about this. New art is commissioned to show off new models. I had a look through the Seraphon book. There isn't a single piece of new art that shows a stegadon, a bastilidon or a trogladon. I'm pretty sure that doesn't mean that those units are disappearing. 

This new range of humans exists because people have been asking for it for ages. Don't forget that the sculpting on this range was completed two or more years ago. Go back and look at two year old posts on this forum. Did anyone start asking for mixed units before GW's announcement last year? I don't remember it. 

People at GW read this forum. They are a company that reacts to the desires of the community. It just happens slowly.  

The higher ups make bad business decisions like no digital battletomes all the time but when it comes to the design team, they frequently follow the desires of the community, albeit with their own spin at times. 

That is so true, over the years community accepted mixed races in CoS but at the start everyone didnt like that

[Clan's Cynic]

14 minutes ago, Chikout said:

I think everyone's being a little too negative about this. New art is commissioned to show off new models. I had a look through the Seraphon book. There isn't a single piece of new art that shows a stegadon, a bastilidon or a trogladon. I'm pretty sure that doesn't mean that those units are disappearing. 

This new range of humans exists because people have been asking for it for ages. Don't forget that the sculpting on this range was completed two or more years ago. Go back and look at two year old posts on this forum. Did anyone start asking for mixed units before GW's announcement last year? I don't remember it. 

People at GW read this forum. They are a company that reacts to the desires of the community. It just happens slowly.  

The higher ups make bad business decisions like no digital battletomes all the time but when it comes to the design team, they frequently follow the desires of the community, albeit with their own spin at times. 

My counterpoint would be: Wood Elves and High Elves getting squatted. A lot of people were sure they weren't going away, but here we are. I'd have expected Dark Elves to go before Wood Elves if anything.

Anxiety over WHFB models being removed isn't really a new fear. 

 

Edited August 5, 2023 by Clan's Cynic

[CDM]

I think this all points to a release of cities dwarves and Aelves one day. There's 15 dark elf warscrolls! 

I would of preferred a bit more of a mixture of elves that's really milybonly gripe. 

The artwork doesn't show Aelves and dwarves with the new stuff but there's loads of studio model photos that do

[Gitzdee]

19 minutes ago, Aleser said:

That is so true, over the years community accepted mixed races in CoS but at the start everyone didnt like that

That is also because that has been the way to play CoS for years now and people have accepted that and unleashed their own creativity on it. Change is not always a bad thing, but this will need some getting used to.

[Chikout]

2 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

My counterpoint would be: Wood Elves and High Elves getting squatted. A lot of people were sure they weren't going away, but here we are.

Anxiety over WHFB models being removed isn't really a new fear. 

 

I get the anxiety over old models leaving and I'm not sure that the cities range is fully settled yet but the message has come loud and clear for the last year that people want the cities to continue to be a melting pot. A good example is Anvilgard. The in lore change to that city would have been a perfect opportunity to cut the dark Aelf range if gw really wanted a human only army. 

The Duardin are doing double duty in AoS and the old world. That would be another perfect excuse to cut them from the range. They could have put out a human only book with 23 warscrolls which is still more than many other battletomes. 

Instead they kept a mix of all three races and even added rules for Misthavn to replace Anvilgard. I suspect that the high elves and wanderers got cut not because gw wanted to make cities human only but rather that wanderers are getting reimagined as Kurnothi and phoenix guard are getting reimagined as the Tyrion half of Lumineth. 

So to sum up. Could we see the current dark Aelf kits go away some time - yes. 

Will Cities ever be a human only faction -no. 

[RyantheFett]

 

My overall reaction to the leaks is pretty much

 

Of course this debate for the faction has been going on forever and I feel like nothing here will change minds for either side. In fact I think it will make things worse.

The book setting hard race requirements for the factions is a bad sign as well as the big red flag of just cutting the high and wood elves. Need to read the new book, but others have said the lore is also a bad sign.

On the other hand, the sub factions each feel very unique. And while some non human they have some good ones as well as some bad human stuff. They also have several units that feel like you can just throw them in any list and they could do some work. That hydra healing 5 health a turn looks fun. And I think the community has made it loud and clear that mix Cities is what most of us want.

We will have most likely wait a few more years before we know for sure what happens to the faction. Hell GW still needs another human wave to remove the rest of the human stuff lol..................

Edited August 5, 2023 by RyantheFett

[Mutton]

Hopefully we get some Dawnbringer books between now and November. Anything is possible now with the logistics issues.

[Chikout]

As to those to say that Duardin are terrible, you can put them in Misthavn to give them more mobility. Hammerers  have  perhaps the best  melee profile of any infantry unit in the game. Without too much difficulty you can get them to hitting on 2 with 6 auto wounding,  wounding on 3, rend -4 damage 2 with strike first. That only takes two buff pieces. If you’re willing to settle for rend 3 you only need the warden king as a buff piece who they handily give a 4+ ward save to. That’s not bad. 

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

16 minutes ago, Chikout said:

As to those to say that Duardin are terrible, you can put them in Misthavn to give them more mobility. Hammerers  have  perhaps the best  melee profile of any infantry unit in the game. Without too much difficulty you can get them to hitting on 2 with 6 auto wounding,  wounding on 3, rend -4 damage 2 with strike first. That only takes two buff pieces. If you’re willing to settle for rend 3 you only need the warden king as a buff piece who they handily give a 4+ ward save to. That’s not bad. 

Also, anything in Cities can Advance in Formation for +3" move, so they are not even that slow if you need them to go somewhere.

[Mutton]

13 minutes ago, Chikout said:

As to those to say that Duardin are terrible, you can put them in Misthavn to give them more mobility. Hammerers  have  perhaps the best  melee profile of any infantry unit in the game. Without too much difficulty you can get them to hitting on 2 with 6 auto wounding,  wounding on 3, rend -4 damage 2 with strike first. That only takes two buff pieces. If you’re willing to settle for rend 3 you only need the warden king as a buff piece who they handily give a 4+ ward save to. That’s not bad. 

Those people are crazy. Duardin are quite strong. Ironbreakers are a 150 point unit with a 3+ save and free 4+ ward on the enemy turn. Try breaking through a wall of 20-30 of those dudes. Their only weakness is mortals outside of the combat phase. But that's almost literally every unit's weakness in this game.

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

12 minutes ago, Mutton said:

Those people are crazy. Duardin are quite strong. Ironbreakers are a 150 point unit with a 3+ save and free 4+ ward on the enemy turn. Try breaking through a wall of 20-30 of those dudes. Their only weakness is mortals outside of the combat phase. But that's almost literally every unit's weakness in this game.

Dark elves are strong, too. I think people are just forgetting that they have first strike and free retreat moves after combat on tap since it's on a different page from the warscrolls.

[Beliman]

32 minutes ago, Chikout said:

As to those to say that Duardin are terrible, you can put them in Misthavn to give them more mobility. Hammerers  have  perhaps the best  melee profile of any infantry unit in the game. Without too much difficulty you can get them to hitting on 2 with 6 auto wounding,  wounding on 3, rend -4 damage 2 with strike first. That only takes two buff pieces. If you’re willing to settle for rend 3 you only need the warden king as a buff piece who they handily give a 4+ ward save to. That’s not bad. 

Duardins seem strong to me. They have elite stats that can still be buffed, and they can break the -3rend rule and have some straightforward tricks for movement or counter-charge just by being part of Cities fo Sigmar.

My only issue with them is that their roster is small for my taste and they don't have the same quantity of tools that other keywords (Humans) have in this book.