The Rumour Thread

[Dragon-knight77]

So, like who exactly are they referring to as "return of a much-loved protagonist"

it singular so it seems to not referring to the factions 

it there going to be the return of a character as a Stormcast or are they referring to nu-Queek?

[Ejecutor]

1 hour ago, Chikout said:

I don't think it has as much to do with the online store as it does with more people looking for a discount in the face of price rises. 

I also thought so, but then why the spike on GW physical sales? There's no discount there.

[Ejecutor]

1 hour ago, Asbestress said:

Totally forgot the shareholder report is out!

I wonder if this means that it was the "most significant" in terms of design and production, or in revenue?

GW knows what is their winning horse.

[Ejecutor]

11 minutes ago, BarakUrbaz said:

Honestly I think people who think that profit margins are too high are missing on two things: Profit can be reinvested into developing new products, and that non-profitable products don't get supported (and if they are supported, its because profitable product essentially subsidizes them).

This is the company that killed one of its core game lines because it didn't sell well enough. For all people are terrified of their models getting squatted, it'll happen a lot more if profit margins are lowered resulting in a lot more stuff becoming unprofitable to make. Plus there's also the chance it will incentivize them to stop taking risks: why make new models for low selling factions when new Space Marines will always sell better no matter what?

This is the key, IMO. We sell "well",  but we are not 40k. Better than GW get big margins so we are safe until the game sells better on its own.

[Ejecutor]

11 minutes ago, BarakUrbaz said:

Honestly I think people who think that profit margins are too high are missing on two things: Profit can be reinvested into developing new products, and that non-profitable products don't get supported (and if they are supported, its because profitable product essentially subsidizes them).

This is the company that killed one of its core game lines because it didn't sell well enough. For all people are terrified of their models getting squatted, it'll happen a lot more if profit margins are lowered resulting in a lot more stuff becoming unprofitable to make. Plus there's also the chance it will incentivize them to stop taking risks: why make new models for low selling factions when new Space Marines will always sell better no matter what?

This is the key, IMO. We sell "well",  but we are not 40k. Better than GW get big margins so we are safe until the game sells better on its own.

[Ejecutor]

6 minutes ago, Dragon-knight77 said:

So, like who exactly are they referring to as "return of a much-loved protagonist"

it singular so it seems to not referring to the factions 

it there going to be the return of a character as a Stormcast or are they referring to nu-Queek?

Maybe just Skavens?

[CommissarRotke]

1 hour ago, BarakUrbaz said:

Honestly I think people who think that profit margins are too high are missing on two things: Profit can be reinvested into developing new products, and that non-profitable products don't get supported (and if they are supported, its because profitable product essentially subsidizes them).

This is the company that killed one of its core game lines because it didn't sell well enough. For all people are terrified of their models getting squatted, it'll happen a lot more if profit margins are lowered resulting in a lot more stuff becoming unprofitable to make. Plus there's also the chance it will incentivize them to stop taking risks: why make new models for low selling factions when new Space Marines will always sell better no matter what?

We're not missing it, we're stating that doing multiple price increases a year is clearly not "necessary" like we're being told. They exist because GW as a publicly-traded company is required to maintain this absurd margin. Average margins are 30% and companies still use that to reinvest in themselves. Nearing 70% is astronomical amounts of cash.

[CommissarRotke]

1 hour ago, Ejecutor said:

I also thought so, but then why the spike on GW physical sales? There's no discount there.

Good chance it's because the physical stores have kits that are "currently out of stock" on the web?

[Chikout]

1 hour ago, Ejecutor said:

I also thought so, but then why the spike on GW physical sales? There's no discount there.

Gw have said numerous times that their physical stores are the number one way they recruit new players. I've been to the Warhammer cafe in Tokyo a few times and there's always at least one member of staff giving the sales pitch to a new customer that just wandered in off the street. They also point out that sales bought online to be shipped to a GW store have increased 50%. These sales are counted as retail sales not online sales. 

[Garrac]

1 hour ago, Ejecutor said:

Maybe just Skavens?

DID SOMEONE JUST SAY NEW SKAVEN????

[Ogregut]

1 hour ago, Dragon-knight77 said:

So, like who exactly are they referring to as "return of a much-loved protagonist"

it singular so it seems to not referring to the factions 

it there going to be the return of a character as a Stormcast or are they referring to nu-Queek?

They mean Skaven. I wouldn't read to much into it or try to forsee future releases. 

[Ejecutor]

36 minutes ago, Chikout said:

Gw have said numerous times that their physical stores are the number one way they recruit new players. I've been to the Warhammer cafe in Tokyo a few times and there's always at least one member of staff giving the sales pitch to a new customer that just wandered in off the street. They also point out that sales bought online to be shipped to a GW store have increased 50%. These sales are counted as retail sales not online sales. 

IMO that's just them wanting to boost store sales, because you can easily track if the order has been done at home or inside a store.

[Gareth 🍄]

27 minutes ago, Chikout said:

They also point out that sales bought online to be shipped to a GW store have increased 50%. These sales are counted as retail sales not online sales. 

"orders from home and picked up in a Warhammer store (reported in Online)"

"products ordered through our in store terminals (reported in Retail)."

[madmac]

2 hours ago, BarakUrbaz said:

Honestly I think people who think that profit margins are too high are missing on two things: Profit can be reinvested into developing new products, and that non-profitable products don't get supported (and if they are supported, its because profitable product essentially subsidizes them).

This is the company that killed one of its core game lines because it didn't sell well enough. For all people are terrified of their models getting squatted, it'll happen a lot more if profit margins are lowered resulting in a lot more stuff becoming unprofitable to make. Plus there's also the chance it will incentivize them to stop taking risks: why make new models for low selling factions when new Space Marines will always sell better no matter what?

There's a middle ground between low profit margins and 70%, I don't think that's crazy to suggest.

[Aleser]

Didnt Whitefang said death will be main protagonists in new eddition, so I think they think about Nagash here

[Ejecutor]

9 minutes ago, Aleser said:

Didnt Whitefang said death will be main protagonists in new eddition, so I think they think about Nagash here

Or Morrda, as it is heavily tied with Ruination

[Baron I_oyd]

16 minutes ago, Aleser said:

Didnt Whitefang said death will be main protagonists in new eddition, so I think they think about Nagash here

jes  I wonder why

[cyrus]

58 minutes ago, Aleser said:

Didnt Whitefang said death will be main protagonists in new eddition, so I think they think about Nagash here

Old rumours says Nagash will be back and he will take his revenge over Skaven 💀 🐀 

[Aramis]

Does the 70% profit just account for the design, manufacture and distribution of minis, and perhaps not account for the game / lore / art development behind that? Or is it in relation to all GW operational spending?

[Ejecutor]

2 minutes ago, Aramis said:

Does the 70% profit just account for the design, manufacture and distribution of minis, and perhaps not account for the game / lore / art development behind that? Or is it in relation to all GW operational spending?

All the spending.

[Hollow]

4 hours ago, CommissarRotke said:

We're not missing it, we're stating that doing multiple price increases a year is clearly not "necessary" like we're being told. They exist because GW as a publicly-traded company is required to maintain this absurd margin.

Do you not see the contradiction in those two sentences? They are necessary to maintain their current margins. GW is a PLC that has a legal responsibility to its shareholders. 

4 hours ago, CommissarRotke said:

Average margins are 30% and companies still use that to reinvest in themselves.

Huh? Sorry, this makes no sense (I'd recommend seeking financial advice if you are ever looking to become an investor in anything). Average margin rates are based on the sector in which a company operates. Engineering and Construction is less than 15%, Financial services are around 85%, Education 40% etc.

A "good" PM can be anywhere from 7.5% to 95%+ and depends entirely on the market in which the company operates.

In the luxury goods market (Which GW is in) LVMH (The largest and most valuable luxury goods company in the world) operates at a profit margin of... you guessed it. 70%!! If GW had a 30% Profit Margin it would be doing terribly (relative to the market it is in.) and shareholders (myself included) would not be happy. 

[Kronos]

10 hours ago, Ejecutor said:

Soon it is going to be the second anniversary of this little fella:



Wouldn't surprise me if we end up having him as some sort of commemorative release or even as part of W+.

 

[Ejecutor]

47 minutes ago, Hollow said:

Do you not see the contradiction in those two sentences? They are necessary to maintain their current margins. GW is a PLC that has a legal responsibility to its shareholders. 

Huh? Sorry, this makes no sense (I'd recommend seeking financial advice if you are ever looking to become an investor in anything). Average margin rates are based on the sector in which a company operates. Engineering and Construction is less than 15%, Financial services are around 85%, Education 40% etc.

A "good" PM can be anywhere from 7.5% to 95%+ and depends entirely on the market in which the company operates.

In the luxury goods market (Which GW is in) LVMH (The largest and most valuable luxury goods company in the world) operates at a profit margin of... you guessed it. 70%!! If GW had a 30% Profit Margin it would be doing terribly (relative to the market it is in.) and shareholders (myself included) would not be happy. 

Purely out of curiosity. Since when do we think GW gave the jump into the luxury sector? Because it is obvious to me that they didn't start as such. There was a big event or it is just that the prices went too high that we assume it is part of that sector?

[Vasshpit]

Geedubs made a bunch of money, cool. 👍

Geedubs products are still over priced, cool. 👍

Still nothing but rats and stormies on the horizon, cool. 👍

These 3 yr cycles really are like two and a half now if even that. 

 

For as profitable as they are you'd think products would rarely be out of stock and all existing lines should set the industry bar. I'm not trying to complain here as I'm a fan for my part but some things just don't add up. 

[Hollow]

1 hour ago, Ejecutor said:

Purely out of curiosity. Since when do we think GW gave the jump into the luxury sector? Because it is obvious to me that they didn't start as such

It's an interesting topic hotly debated in investor circles because the reality is that "luxury" is a subjective term. "One man's treasure is another man's trash" I would ask you... "What makes it obvious to you that they didn't start as such?" 

This is a quote from a decent Vox article detailing the surge in "luxury" good sales and why that particular market is booming - 

"Analysts have a nebulous definition of what constitutes a luxury good, but it’s usually an object that not only has a sky-high price but also promises quality craftsmanship and an air of exclusivity. It shouldn’t be something everyone has."

I would argue that Warhammer has always been a "high-end" product, but there was a significant shift beginning in 2015 when Kevin D. Rountree became CEO. A man with incredible financial literacy (and previous CFO) who understands the numbers but also has a firm grasp of marketing, exclusivity and consumer practices. 

It's also the case that regardless of a vocal online minority of (usually established long-term hobby veterans) GW operates at the bottom end of pricing structures for luxury and collectable goods.

Anecdotally - I was just in London for a few days and went to Selfridges with my nieces who were desperate to get their hands on an exclusive range of store-specific Jellycat-Fish and chip plushy toys. The pop-up shop is open for a limited time and the 15 minutes time slots are booked out every day for the next 5 weeks. The queue was 6+hours long and they stopped taking people at 11.50 after opening at 11:30. For the full set of 7 little toys with pins, and assorted paperwork costs over £250. (some sets are now on ebay for £400-£500) This is for 7 hand-sized cuddly toys for kids ages 3-12! 

Desire often creates a potent feeling of need, one that can be hard to reason away precisely because it isn’t rational. It’s infatuation, limerence.

“They’re in the business of selling dreams, You buy a piece of a dream.”

Edited July 31 by Hollow