The Rumour Thread

[Ejecutor]

4 minutes ago, Garrac said:

Acording to skaven lore, during the age of chaos skaven were on a civil war. They never got a W out of it (except if we count killing other skaven)

Yeah, but the world is still infested by Chaos and Skavens are constantly getting wins. Afaik of Skavens stopping Nagash. That's a major win.

Edited August 5 by Ejecutor

[ScionOfOssia]

26 minutes ago, Garrac said:

I don't inow, skaven havent had a W on AoS since... Actually I think theyve never had one???

Broken Realms, they were vital in Belakor’s Silver Tower scheme. They also were the *only* faction prepared for Sigmar’s Tempest. They also are the only reason Nagash’s ritual misfired and caused the Necroquake instead of instantly killing everyone, everywhere. 

[Garrac]

28 minutes ago, ScionOfOssia said:

Broken Realms, they were vital in Belakor’s Silver Tower scheme. They also were the *only* faction prepared for Sigmar’s Tempest. They also are the only reason Nagash’s ritual misfired and caused the Necroquake instead of instantly killing everyone, everywhere. 

I stand corrected then. But I mean, it's not the same as winning an *actual* battle.

[Goatforce]

32 minutes ago, Garrac said:

I stand corrected then. But I mean, it's not the same as winning an *actual* battle.

True, but then in narratives and such for WH the only time a "bad guy" army tends to get a win is vs another "bad guy". Generally speaking them's the breaks unfortunately, kinda an issue for most evil armies that they are often there as punching bags for the good guys - not always of course but most of the time.

[Ejecutor]

9 minutes ago, Goatforce said:

True, but then in narratives and such for WH the only time a "bad guy" army tends to get a win is vs another "bad guy". Generally speaking them's the breaks unfortunately, kinda an issue for most evil armies that they are often there as punching bags for the good guys - not always of course but most of the time.

With a setting so close to being obliterated by the bad guys it is easier to give wins to the underdog, which is currently order. Otherwise we will have a second end of times.

[CommissarRotke]

1 hour ago, Garrac said:

I don't inow, skaven havent had a W on AoS since... Actually I think theyve never had one???

brother, you stopped Nagash from consuming the Realms and created the Necroquake

[Someravella]

Do you think this unbalance between SCE and Skaven is a bit cooked for supporting a narrative that will eventually lead to Nagash Ex Machina punching Skreech in the face?

Edited August 6 by Someravella

[ScionOfOssia]

4 minutes ago, Someravella said:

Do you think this unbalance between SCE and Skaven is a bit cooked for supportyng a narrative that will eventually lead to Nagash Ex Machina punching Skreech in the face?

God I hope so. It would be hilarious to see the reversal of roles. 

[Ejecutor]

When do we think the Skavendoom will end? Before Chorfs? After Chorfs but before the ending campaign? As part of the ending campaign?

Would be interesting to see how Chorfs are part of all of this.

[cyrus]

3 hours ago, HorticulusTGA said:

Gotta say I'm quite disappointed with the Hel Crown result (which seems absolutely planned, to the reveal show logo with Skaven writings).

We knew the Skaven Wave content since months, the first Skaven leak was the Brood Horror from the Core Book, and I can't believe Stormcasta - as the Starter Set faction for 4 editions straight - has fewer players / collectors than Skaven (who is a beloved faction but quite neglected in AOS since the End Times).

They really really really need to show the Stormcasts at NOVA at the end of the month. Valrak is talking about that reveal a lot (for 40k of course) so I guess it will be large enough to see the remaining Ruination kits....

It is exactly the same that happened last year with Battle of Ogrham and Tyranids .

 

Stormcast full reveal will be at Nova same as Space marines last year : https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/08/31/the-nova-open-2023-preview-all-of-the-reveals-right-here/

Edited August 5 by cyrus

[ScionOfOssia]

Just now, Ejecutor said:

When do we think the Skavendoom will end?

End of the Edition, same as the Necroquake, but I expect the Skaven take a backseat for the latter half following the Chorf launch like how Nighthaunt ended up second fiddle to the Ossiarchs narratively. 

[HorticulusTGA]

3 minutes ago, cyrus said:

Stormcast full reveal will be at Nova same as Space marines last year : https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/08/31/the-nova-open-2023-preview-all-of-the-reveals-right-here/

As the Stormcasts won at Hel's Claw and as it is already esthablished that the Adamantine Chaine will be the bulkwark against the Gnaw, we kinda knew the Skaven would won... BUT it's still sad as Hel Crown looked like an interesting setting. 

And yeah, if - IF - the Stormcast range is revealed at NOVA then all is fine, but we don't have confirmaiton...

[Garrac]

The polls are now closed. Hel Crown is open for the looting-taking. Corpses from both sides lay on the ground, while the rats come to eat the spoils. 

Green clouds spawn on the horizon, hiding the rays of light. In the darkness, a swarm of hideous figures stand. These rats are bigger, stronger, and crueler. The air is filled with the squeaks of the survivors, searching, sniffing, looting, killing even their own kind without apparent reason.

But on top of the squeaks, the clipping of swords, and the green lightnings from the sky, there's another sound, the sound of a bell that, somehow, can be heard across the eight realms.

It's the 13th time it tolls.

DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM

It's the sound of victory.

Edited August 5 by Garrac

[Ejecutor]

15 minutes ago, HorticulusTGA said:

As the Stormcasts won at Hel's Claw and as it is already esthablished that the Adamantine Chaine will be the bulkwark against the Gnaw, we kinda knew the Skaven would won... BUT it's still sad as Hel Crown looked like an interesting setting. 

And yeah, if - IF - the Stormcast range is revealed at NOVA then all is fine, but we don't have confirmaiton...

We have confirmation. It was always said that the winner would be showcased earlier. And we have the precedence of 40k from last year. There's nothing else to showcase for AoS apart from maybe a roadmap.

[Goatforce]

1 hour ago, Ejecutor said:

With a setting so close to being obliterated by the bad guys it is easier to give wins to the underdog, which is currently order. Otherwise we will have a second end of times.

True, but it is fairly rare to see the bad guys make any headway (except vs each other) outside of essentially once every 3 years where they get given an event as the hook for the next edition.

I don't think it is a massive issue, the lore after all is basically there to give context to the models that are sold, but imo it can often feel like the apocalyptic threats aren't really that threatening from the actual stories told and the antagonists don't really earn the "they are evil incarnate and have destroyed nations single handed and are the children of dark gods etc, etc" when Terry the Stormcast beats their ass the one time they actually show up in 3 years..... Looking at you Dexcessa and Synessa, incredibly hyped up children of Slaanesh and Morathi, who's one narrative appearance was them getting destroyed by a couple of witch hunters and SC, then Be'Lakor becoming the collective voice of the reader telling them how dissapointing they were.

Anyway, with my little rant over the problem with this is it just kinda makes these cool characters who we are told are powerful just feel like jobbers, unless they absoltely have to win in order to do something specific in the narrative - eg Olynder vs Celestant Prime was required to free Katakross. Just feel that the villains could win a little more often and that would make them more compelling and threatening. I guess it doesn't help that generally non-novel lore is fairly thin on the ground. As I recall 3rd Ed got 1 narrative book outside of Dawnbringers, though Covid might have effected that.

[GloomkingWortwazi]

6 hours ago, Captaniser said:

Have we considered that SG was simply trolling a little bit by giving an accurate description of Queek but not mentioning him by name just to see who would catch on?

More or less. They're being cheeky. The "だれだ" at the end is a casual kind of "who are you?" / "who is there?" phrase.

Edited August 6 by GloomkingWortwazi
he to they

[Big Kim Woof-Woof]

6 hours ago, Goatforce said:

Looking at you Dexcessa and Synessa, incredibly hyped up children of Slaanesh

[Mutton]

Skaven haven't had new models in like 20 years and people are already complaining that they get their preview first?

Who cares if we know generally what they might get. That's way different than seeing how exactly it turns out. Stormcast get a new model every time I take a ******. Let the rats have their moment to shine in the smokey warpstone glow.

[Ejecutor]

10 hours ago, Goatforce said:

True, but it is fairly rare to see the bad guys make any headway (except vs each other) outside of essentially once every 3 years where they get given an event as the hook for the next edition.

I don't think it is a massive issue, the lore after all is basically there to give context to the models that are sold, but imo it can often feel like the apocalyptic threats aren't really that threatening from the actual stories told and the antagonists don't really earn the "they are evil incarnate and have destroyed nations single handed and are the children of dark gods etc, etc" when Terry the Stormcast beats their ass the one time they actually show up in 3 years..... Looking at you Dexcessa and Synessa, incredibly hyped up children of Slaanesh and Morathi, who's one narrative appearance was them getting destroyed by a couple of witch hunters and SC, then Be'Lakor becoming the collective voice of the reader telling them how dissapointing they were.

Anyway, with my little rant over the problem with this is it just kinda makes these cool characters who we are told are powerful just feel like jobbers, unless they absoltely have to win in order to do something specific in the narrative - eg Olynder vs Celestant Prime was required to free Katakross. Just feel that the villains could win a little more often and that would make them more compelling and threatening. I guess it doesn't help that generally non-novel lore is fairly thin on the ground. As I recall 3rd Ed got 1 narrative book outside of Dawnbringers, though Covid might have effected that.

I think it is a problem with both the setting and the narratives.

1. The setting. Having a setting with the balance so turned into the Chaos side doesn't give you too much room for massive winnings. Especially if they are consecutive. It will be something more sporadic and the big wins would need to be undone in order to maintain the balance.

If the status quo after Sigmar's Storm would have been something like 50/50 or 60/40 we would have more room for stuff like that. Even with that, the Skavendoom is massive for a setting like the AoS one.

2. The narratives. We are constantly being told that the "bad guys" are getting wins over and over. For example, the Dawnbringers Crusades rate was 1 out of 10 before the Castellite formation. I think with the Castellite formation it increased to 2-4 out of 10 (don't recall the right numbers). Order is still having massive losses, but they are not described too often.

With this push in Dawnbringer Crusades and the Order territory being expanded, hopefully the balance is changed a bit and the setting gives more room for bigger wins outside of the Order side without it meaning a second end of times.

Edited August 6 by Ejecutor

[PraetorDragoon]

Part of the issue with Apocalyptic threats is that they are well... apocalyptic. With the narrative focussed on a tiny part of the realms, it means that if the apocalyptic threat succeeds, the good guys will simply lose any foothold they have in those realms. 

[Beliman]

What would happen (game-wise) if Hammerfall falls to Chaos?

[Ejecutor]

3 minutes ago, Beliman said:

What would happen (game-wise) if Hammerfall falls to Chaos?

Game wise? CoS would lose two of their cities (Hammerhall Aqsha and Ghyra. They are not subfactions anymore, but their battalions). And I think that would be all.

Lore wise the implications would be huge, as Hammerhall acts as the leading city of all the CoS around the mortal realms.

[Beliman]

13 minutes ago, Ejecutor said:

Game wise? CoS would lose two of their cities (Hammerhall Aqsha and Ghyra. They are not subfactions anymore, but their battalions). And I think that would be all.

Lore wise the implications would be huge, as Hammerhall acts as the leading city of all the CoS around the mortal realms.

It sounds harsh, but that's not a problem for the setting.

Rules wise, is not a problem. Just avoid killing any named characters that will stay in production for the next 6 years.

Lore wise, instead of a problem, it is an opportunity to strengthen AoS's IP.
It can be our Fall of Cadia, Black Crusade, Tyrannic Wars, the Great war against Chaos. Just milk the cow as much as you can: Explore the Ruins of Hammerfall in Warcry, Warhammer Quest, new Black Library books, a new Soulbound expansion, etc... 

Edited August 6 by Beliman

[PraetorDragoon]

17 minutes ago, Beliman said:

It sounds harsh, but that's not a problem for the setting.

Rules wise, is not a problem. Just avoid killing any named characters that will stay in production for the next 6 years.

Lore wise, instead of a problem, it is an opportunity to strengthen AoS's IP.
It can be our Fall of Cadia, Black Crusade, Tyrannic Wars, the Great war against Chaos. Just milk the cow as much as you can: Explore the Ruins of Hammerfall in Warcry, Warhammer Quest, new Black Library books, a new Soulbound expansion, etc... 

Its telling that the only clear evil victory you mention here is the Fall of Cadia. Black Crusades weren't that succesful, The Tyrannids lost half of the Tyrannic Wars, and the Great War against Chaos was lost by Chaos.

[Beliman]

12 minutes ago, PraetorDragoon said:

Its telling that the only clear evil victory you mention here is the Fall of Cadia. Black Crusades weren't that succesful, The Tyrannids lost half of the Tyrannic Wars, and the Great War against Chaos was lost by Chaos.

The point is not "an evil victory", the point is to have a great impact on the setting that people will still remember after some years. Taking down Order is one of the tools that the narrative has.

Edited August 6 by Beliman