General Chat Thread

[JackStreicher]

Wasn’t there a video showing how pink or purple works for teal or turquoise as shadow color?

I just can’t find that video, can anybody help?

[Acrozatarim]

I also have a painting-related question. In either this thread or the rumour thread someone posted pics of a CoS arch-knight and gargoylian painted in a very nice deep sea-green hue, but I can't find them now.

Does anyone have a link to wherever those pics originally came from, or know the paints they used to get those hues?

[Ejecutor]

4 minutes ago, Acrozatarim said:

I also have a painting-related question. In either this thread or the rumour thread someone posted pics of a CoS arch-knight and gargoylian painted in a very nice deep sea-green hue, but I can't find them now.

Does anyone have a link to wherever those pics originally came from, or know the paints they used to get those hues?

This one?
 

 

[Acrozatarim]

6 minutes ago, Ejecutor said:

This one?
 

 

That's the one, yes! Did the Pinterest you saw give any info on what the paints they used for that were?

[Ejecutor]

Just now, Acrozatarim said:

That's the one, yes! Did the Pinterest you saw give any info on what the paints they used for that were?

This is the original reddit post: 

Maybe you can ask there.

[Acrozatarim]

Cheers!

[MitGas]

On 8/10/2024 at 6:54 PM, JackStreicher said:

Wasn’t there a video showing how pink or purple works for teal or turquoise as shadow color?

I just can’t find that video, can anybody help?

Haven‘t seen the video in question but frankly all cold colors mix really well - you can easily go from green (with a blue component to it) up to purplish magenta on the same cloak and it looks good… at least on Tzeentch stuff. 😂 Usually I prefer to use colder hues in the shadows though than vice versa. Warmer tones in the shadows usually give it an artificial light mood, broadly speaking. Which can also work, depending on what one‘s going for. 👍
 

 

[Beliman]

So, a few more games:

Imho, even if the game has some balance issues (not as bad as it seems, unless you are going for AOS Worlds or stuff like that), the game has so much potential. 

I'm at that time that I just don't use any CP in my turn, just waiting for Covering-Fire, Redeploy, Counter-Charge and All-Out-Defense. Some armies are more prepared to do so, but everyone has their own play that will be improved by Commands Points (Slaves of Chaos/SCE using All-Out-Defense or Charge-Reroll is just as good as an Assault Boat Counter-Charge).

I learn a lot of good stuff every time I play 4th, and I must say that I want to play more after each game.

Reinforces cavalry and manifestations casts with units that have any cast bonus are a bit problematic because only other cavalry units can kill 30wounds on a 3+ save (probably with All-Out-Defense), but that's a minor problem that I hope it will be fixe'd.

I can't wait to see the first battletomes!

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

1 hour ago, Beliman said:

So, a few more games:

Imho, even if the game has some balance issues (not as bad as it seems, unless you are going for AOS Worlds or stuff like that), the game has so much potential. 

I'm at that time that I just don't use any CP in my turn, just waiting for Covering-Fire, Redeploy, Counter-Charge and All-Out-Defense. Some armies are more prepared to do so, but everyone has their own play that will be improved by Commands Points (Slaves of Chaos/SCE using All-Out-Defense or Charge-Reroll is just as good as an Assault Boat Counter-Charge).

I learn a lot of good stuff every time I play 4th, and I must say that I want to play more after each game.

Reinforces cavalry and manifestations casts with units that have any cast bonus are a bit problematic because only other cavalry units can kill 30wounds on a 3+ save (probably with All-Out-Defense), but that's a minor problem that I hope it will be fixe'd.

I can't wait to see the first battletomes!

Completely agree. I am also in the process of getting more games in and discovering more of the nuances of the new rules. In my opinion, the decision making around command points and list building has become a lot more nuanced than in 3rd, which I enjoy a lot.

Cavalry seems like an over-performer pretty much game wide right now. But I think that might be fixable with points. I believe most cavalry units are just too efficient purely on numbers right now. Although I have definitely had situations where my own cav was blown out by anti-cav units, as well, so it's not like they are unbeatable. Just really strong and efficient, especially coupled with the battle plans we have right now where deployment is often just 18" apart.

Manifestations will get a rebalancing, I am pretty sure of that at this point. At Morbid Conjuration is too strong, at least. I do enjoy finally seeing Endless Spells on the table in my own games, though. I have been playing since 2nd ed and barely ever saw them, but I think they are a cool element unique to AoS. They kind of play the role that templates serve in WHFB, but IMO they are a lot more fun because they are tied more closely to the setting.

Also, I literally just got the box, so please let me play with them for a few months before nerfing them into the ground, GW.

[PraetorDragoon]

53 minutes ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

Also, I literally just got the box, so please let me play with them for a few months before nerfing them into the ground, GW.

They will be nerfed the exact point you finish painting them!

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

1 minute ago, PraetorDragoon said:

They will be nerfed the exact point you finish painting them!

How do you dare speak this into existence?

[PraetorDragoon]

3 minutes ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

How do you dare speak this into existence?

You were the one who taunted fate first.

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

9 minutes ago, PraetorDragoon said:

You were the one who taunted fate first.

Might as well keep going then.

Kairos is a giant chicken and if he comes after me he will find 11 secret herbs and spices in his future.

Edited August 13 by Neil Arthur Hotep

[Ejecutor]

1 hour ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

How do you dare speak this into existence?

In fact we have a new FAQ in warcom nerfing them right now!

[MitGas]

13 hours ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

Might as well keep going then.

Kairos is a giant chicken and if he comes after me he will find 11 secret herbs and spices in his future.

 

Someone‘s just secured himself a top spot on the naughty list. 

[Beliman]

There is a rumour about a new FAQ/ errata/ Battlescroll / whatever early september. If that's the case, what do you expect?

Starting with Kharadrons, I would like to see a lot of changes (wish list based on what looks cool):

• 2 new Battle Formations: One based on Barak-Zon (buffing charges) and the other in Barak-Mhornar (reduce Control from near enemy units).
  Explanation: Kharadrons doesn't have Magic, Prayers, Manifestations and Terrain, and as we saw with Drukhari, GW can add subfactions any time they want.
   
• 3 new artifacts: I woudn't mind to see the return of Bomblets and Spell in the bottle.
  Explanation: Same as above
   
• Skywardens and Endrinriggers: 
  • Skywardens: +1 damage on charge.
    Explanation: Point-wise, they are like all cavalry units, but without the usual 3+ save and 3 health and a worst keyword (Infantry).
     
  • Endrinriggers: +1 to save characteristic. +1 Ward for ships near them.
    Explanation: Like skywardens, they need to be glasscannon or bring something defensive. With their healing ability and less damage than skywardens, they should be more about defense.
     
• Grundstock Thunderers: Change their profiles:
  • Aethershot Rifle change wound to 3+, increase rend to 2 but reduced range to 12".
  • Aetheric Fumigator or Decksweeper (Anti-Infantry) increase range to 12"
  • Grundstock Mortar or AetherCannon (Anti-Monster). Increase damage to 2.
    Explanation: Self explanatory.
     
• All skyvessels: -20/-40 points.
  Explanation: They are our "battle traits", and we pay a lot of points for them. When an elite army has over 10 or more models, it doens't feel right. Take in mind that we can't spam them because most heroes can only take 0-1 skyvessels in their detachments.
   
• Grundstock Gunhauler: Transport Capacity 6 models. Gunhaulers from Grundscorp Expeditonary Force can transport 2 units with the same capacity .
  Explanation: Unlocks 6 skwardens or Riggers for KO lists; and unlock 5 Grundstock Thunderers + Hero for our Army of Renown.
   
• Weapon Loadouts:
  Take in mind that our loadouts are not just an added bonus to our units. Most models lose their weapon that usually has more damage/synergies than an special weapon.
  • All Cannons (Gunhauler, Frigate, Ironclad): Change all profiles to 4+/2+/rend 2. Damage changed to 1D3+1 (Gunhauler), 1d3+2 (Figate) and 1D3+4 (Ironclad).
    Explanation: Most warmachines already cost a lot less than our ships and have the basic  4+/2+/rend2 profile, so put all cannons on the same square and change range/damage.
     
  • All Volley Guns (Skywardens, Endrinriggers, Arkanaut Company, Arkanaut Ironclad): Remove Crit (2hits) for Anti-Infantry. Change to Wound to 3+.
  • Explanation: Just standarize all profiles.
     
  • All Skyhooks (Skywardens, Endrinriggers, Arkanaut Company, Arkanaut Ironclad): Change profile to 2 attacks at 4+/2+/-2. Anti-Monster, Anti-Manifestation. Double damage to Monsters and Manifestations.
    Explanation: Just standarize all profiles and make Skyhooks our main tool to kill Manifestations, remember that we don't have Krondspine and/or Banish.
     
  • Grappnel Launcher (Endrinriggers, Skywardens):  Once per game. In your charge phase. On a 3+ dice, can use 3D6 to charge.
    Explanation: That will make our charging balloon boys a bit more independent from our ships.
     
  • Drill Cannon (Gunhauler): Drill Cannon wounding on 2+
    Explanation: Cannons are more reliable with two shots, but Skycannons should be scarier with 3 plain damage and rend 3. For a 200p unit, 1 shot at 3+/2+ seems to be the right spot (even if it's not as good as other options).        
• Drekki-Flynt: Captain of the Aesling, add +1 damage and -1 to rend for Aesling's Boarding Weapons. 
  Explanation: Aesling has an Ogor inside, and there is no sight of Krenen the Runemaster. +1 damage to 4+/4+ is not enough, but with +1 rend, I think it would be really good.
   
• Arkanaut Admiral: Remove "Every Gun To Bear", and add "First Rule of Grungsson" (Brokk) for just one skyvessel (like they had before).
  Explanation: Instead of giving them a niche job to give +1 atk to an Ironclad, just turn them in to a budget-Brokk. 

Appart from that, I would like to see some Core Rules changes:

• Cavalry units: If they have 5 models, can't be Reinforced.
  Explanation: The main problem is that a unit that already has awesome staying power (3+ save with 15 health) and can double their damage with a charge (charge (+1damage)), players can double both bonus with 5 more cavalry models.
   
• Endless Spells: Wizard that attemps to cast/chant a manifestation ignore positive modifiers.
  Explanation: Imho, most Endless Spells already have a 50/50 change to be cast (or worst). Without any bonus to cast, the player has a great choise in to cast a spell with some bonus or a manifestation without any bonus. That would put basic spells on the menu again.

Conclusion: I know, it's a lot and it will not happen, but whatever, I had that list in my mind for a few days so...

Edited August 15 by Beliman

[JackStreicher]

Purple (barak Nar burgundy) + Turquoise works well!

Mechanicum standard grey primer

Edited August 14 by JackStreicher

[ScionOfOssia]

6 hours ago, Beliman said:

There is a rumour about a new FAQ/ errata/ Battlescroll / whatever early september. If that's the case, what do you expect?

 

They don’t hit Nighthaunt, S2D, Lumineth, SBGL, or Manifestations nearly hard enough, the IDK catch strays that make listbuilding for them even harder than it already is and makes playing them for more than 2 games result in a massive migraine, and the OBR don’t get the point changes they need and the Ossifector still can’t bring the Crawler in its regiment. 

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

6 hours ago, Beliman said:

There is a rumour about a new FAQ/ errata/ Battlescroll / whatever early september. If that's the case, what do you expect?

Cavalry seems to be over-performing across armies, so I would expect some points uncreases for them.

People are not super happy with Manifestations. I believe they will get some kind of tweak, but one that doesn't affect how they play as radically as some people would like. Morbid Conjuration needs to be rebalanced. My favourite way would be to pull out Purple Sun into a lore of its own like the Krondspine (with a new warscroll).

Some people are complaining about list building, but I think the restrictions on that are working as intended from the rules writers' point of view. At the very least, they are not so obviously broken that they need immediate changes across the board. Individual factions might get tweaks. 

Underdog seems frequently to strong, but is established by the battle plans. It will only get changed when new battle plans come out.

Factions: Nighthaunt too good, needs big nerfs. S2D, just seem to point efficient and should go up. Especially Varanguard who are invalidating too many other units in the book. Gitz and KO seem to weak and would benefit from targeted buffs and point drops. KO especially feels too elite right now given that they cannot participate in the Manifestation game.

For my pet unit: The Steam Tanks should get some small point drops and shoot in combat on the steam gun. I think it is currently not playable.

 

[woolf]

Guess would be some change to how manifestation work mechanically to limit spamming them a bit. And then just pts tweaks, 10 up here and there, 10 down kinda. They can't have enough data really at this point, hopefully they hit some of the super obvious stuff like NH subfaction for run & retreat + charge...

[Big Kim Woof-Woof]

12 hours ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

S2D, just seem to point efficient and should go up. Especially Varanguard who are invalidating too many other units in the book. 

I'd agree with that. I played against a Slaves army that was heavy on the Varanguard and Chaos Knights last weekend, and I could barely put a dent in them. I'm all for 'elite' armies, but it felt like they could plonk down way too much good stuff for a 1500 points game. 

[MitGas]

5 hours ago, Big Kim Woof-Woof said:

I'd agree with that. I played against a Slaves army that was heavy on the Varanguard and Chaos Knights last weekend, and I could barely put a dent in them. I'm all for 'elite' armies, but it felt like they could plonk down way too much good stuff for a 1500 points game. 

Will the GW way of „fixing“ units in AoS by making them cost 10 more points be enough though? 😂

I doubt it, it didn‘t really balance things all that much before either. I guess proper balancing will only  happen via the new battletomes. 
 

…. If only we could use those Slaves units ourselves (obviously without the nice mark effects), then we could even the playfield. But some genius took that away from us as well and gave us nothing in return. 🙄👎 Especially problematic for Slaanesh and Nurgle, they could use S2D quite a bit I believe. Tzeentch can at least spam manifestations right now and ruin the fun for everyone 😎

Edited August 15 by MitGas

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

15 minutes ago, MitGas said:

Will the GW way of „fixing“ units in AoS by making them cost 10 more points be enough though? 😂

I doubt it, it didn‘t really balance things all that much before either. I guess proper balancing will only  happen via the new battletomes. 
 

…. If only we could use those Slaves units ourselves (obviously without the nice mark effects), then we could even the playfield. But some genius took that away from us as well and gave us nothing in return. 🙄👎 Especially problematic for Slaanesh and Nurgle, they could use S2D quite a bit I believe. Tzeentch can at least spam manifestations right now and ruin the fun for everyone 😎

Despite everything, Tzeentch is pretty likely to catch some nerfs, too. They are also part of the over-performers, along with Lumineth.

[MitGas]

3 minutes ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

Despite everything, Tzeentch is pretty likely to catch some nerfs, too. They are also part of the over-performers, along with Lumineth.

Take the manifestations away (or fix em)  and the problem is solved. I don’t think our normal magic is a problem at this point, our units certainly aren’t. Which is why I want to see manifestations fixed ASAP. Probably applies to Lumineth as well… and perhaps Seraphon. 
 

I figure Nighthaunt and Slaves are unit-wise currently the only armies to be really a cut above the rest. 
 

And then we‘ll see where Skaven and SCE will ultimately land with their new battletomes.

 

[Arzalyn]

18 hours ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

Individual factions might get tweaks. 

The main tweak I would like to see is increasing the number of "extra heroes" some factions get. Armys with small rosters usually have 50% or more of the their warscrolls as heroes and most of them have like 1 or 2 max extra heroes. This leave many heroes with niche effects that could be cool to use out of list due to them needing a extra drop.

19 hours ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

Cavalry seems to be over-performing across armies, so I would expect some points uncreases for them.

I've been wondering if increasing the number of anti-cavalry attacks in some factions could be a option to reduce their power (together with points increases to make the internal balance better).