Pizzaprez

Can't say I'm surprised; I wasn't a huge fan of the expensive "incarnate + terrain" box, and I've felt like the separate boxes had a higher price than I'd have liked. I wish they chopped off some of the price and didn't include a battlemat, but that may just be me I'm extremely disappointed they scrapped the intact dawnbringer buildings!! I was looking forward to them and, if the LOTR buildings were any indication, they could have been an excellent kit! I did get a Thondian Strongpoint on sale, but half the reason I wanted the construction sites was in anticipation of finished buildings! Ah well - I've got half a mind to cast copies of the doors and add em to some scratch built stuff aaaaah that's so exciting! She's always been my favorite vampire character; I love the "Vampires in disguise hiding in plain sight" trope New Dawnbringer short was neat; interesting that the Daughters character came with Dark Aelf friends! Wonder if that isn't going to be reflected on the tabletop somehow: maybe Daelves are heading to the Khanite book? With cities seemingly becoming "mostly humans" I wonder if the Daelves are on the outs

I'm going to continue to hope that the Morghast wing we saw is actually a reboot of Arkhan's sick flying chariot from the early days! With TOW in play, he'd be one that could pull double duty as a Tomb Kings character as well; especially if they didn't Ossiarch him too too hard aesthetically

With Nagash and Arkhan both currently "dead," I would love if this edition focused on that GA! Either in the context of "how are things with these factions that were very much on Nagash's short leash" or "how are the Death factions acting/reacting without Nagash and Arkhan breathing down their necks?" Olynder is a wildcard, Katakros is struggling with his wound from Archaon, Ushoran is back and active with some sort of plan he's hiding, Neferata is seemingly on the backfoot; a mention about her and Mannfred at war and she's now very much been duped by the ghouls, Mannfred has... not done much? He's arguably the protagonist of the first act of the End Times and I cant remember much at all that he's been up to in AoS; very exciting stuff narratively!

I think extremely extremely good within a decade or so. Not at launch. Looking at AoS, we're likely to get a couple "sub factions" from the army, mentions of other things/factions/characters existing in the narrative, and then a couple followup waves later on to keep interest up. The Bretonnia articles mention a couple times how, in designing new things, they were considering how (if time/success/finances allow) they could circle back to update older kits. That's planning an extremely long game when not everyone has even had an initial release! I'm so excited to pick up that Great Moon Bird in like six years!!!

I also think FEC are in a slightly different place tbh They're part of (a third at best) of Vampire Counts; a faction that is otherwise sticking to AoS. Beasts pretty much were a direct copy-paste of theirselves from Fantasy, especially when they re-lost marks in the second tome. Outside of the fact that Dragon Ogors lived in Azyr until chaos came back and Morghur is a god-thing and is corrupting the incarnates iirc there is nothing new for them. Real NPC status so far, and not a lot has been built on the foundations they've poured for them narratively: I was shook when we only got one Season of War and the plot threads were seemingly abandoned (like the spider) FEC, though, got a complete narrative overhaul even if it wasn't initially reflected in the toys. They were also borderline NPC's but they kept getting interesting updates and lore hooks narratively. With Ushoran "existing! maybe trapped!" and then def existing and trapped and now he's entering the story in a big way, FEC are not going anywhere and have a few very interesting paths forward for how thy could continue to hit the narrative in important ways. Ushoran is back and making things happen. I'd expected the same for Beasts and Morghur, but Beastmen are a whole faction in their own right. Moving them to TOW "just" means axing them from AoS. Putting "ghouls" in TOW means splitting them from Vampire Counts or putting the whole VC line in that game too. The two could have sold almost identically and I bet it wouldn't have changed a thing. TOW can "add" a classic faction by "simply" cutting it from AoS entirely. Nice and neat! So, like, what is going to happen with Morghur then? Like, is all that just done? Is the new Sylvaneth tome going to drop with "Alarielle smacked him to death in the spirit realm offscreen?"

Wouldn't it be quite the twist if, somehow, we lose Beasts but keep Dragon Ogors? Slaves don't currently have a "big centaur" and, outside Morghur, the lore for Dragon Ogors has actually been the consistent plot point that has made me feel like they're not going anywhere and will eventually have a stake in the plot. Outside of like, the fact that they're isolated sometimes they (iirc) dont seem to have the same sheer hatred of civilization that the rest of BoC does. In my head, they occupy a similar niche to the Mindstealers and Ogroids: species that chaos has permanently imprinted itself onto However, they would occupy a similar tactical niche to Varanguard now that I'm really thinking about it.... but narratively I could 1000% see them (led by a new named Dragon Ogor Shaggoth character) bending a knee to Archaon to get a slice of the "invading Azyr" pie

Those are beautiful! I love the Great Moon Bird in particular! Maybe my Cities project will just happily sit in boxes for awhile longer, hahaha, those would make for such cool sculpts!

Earlier in the BoC discussion i'd listed how many projects I'd worked on got scrapped over the years and it sucks; not trying to be hypernegative so I'm not going to repeat myself, but I am right there with y'all. Unless you want to play TOW, please keep your beasts on circles! There are other wargames that'd let you use them as-is, and you might wind up liking proxying them as something else in AoS in time: my long-dormant azgorh army was becoming Slaves to Darkness even before the Horns unit came out. Almost dropped Legion of Grief and the silly amount of models I'd bought for it when it got squatted, but my friends were pretty cool about mixing Soulblights and Nighthaunts even if it wasnt official and I've poked around at a couple other game systems too Love AoS as a setting and the models GW produces, but I'm right there with everyone in this thread not loving the feeling of looking at certain armies and subfactions and wondering "how much time does this have left?" I'm excited about almost everything else we've heard about AoS4, and I'm pretty bummed out that the army I want most almost feels like a monkey's paw moment; losing the other coolest chaos army as a tradeoff.

Stormcast new stuff is always interesting to me! Somewhere back in this thread I'd seen "stormcast flagellants" mentioned and I'd be real hyped if they look cool Love this idea, and love that between this and the Kruleboyz swamps we're seeing "destruction" also become "destruction of biospheres and ecosystems" instead of just cities which gives them a lot more room to play That sort of makes sense to a certain degree, though I would've loved if they could have figured it out. Thematically, I do see how Dragon Ogor warclans don't quite mesh with the "lets sacrifice as many ungors as we can to summon monsters" vibe but I think GW could've worked it out! Removing the options for marks, to me, was a mistake: it'd have allowed people to physically theme their army with more ease! I'm going to keep huffing copium, though, because I love Morghur

Ah! So good to hear about the spells and terrain! I've got a few projects drawn up that'd require both, so I'm glad to hear my wallet can breathe easy for a bit haha Cool to hear Tau are getting Vespids! They're neat; wonder if Tau isn't getting plastics of their existing friendly species to make way for something new eventually? 👀

One thing I'm excited to see next edition is which random armies/units are deemed fit for an update using Warcry as a vehicle! Lots of weird/new ideas there Can't say anything i've bought for WH has been heavier! Might have to spring on the AoS4 box if my rat-loving buddy is into the skaven half! I hope TOW is a clue! Seraphon would be fun to see get some brand new stuff for that's very AoS! All their new kits are so pretty that I had to actively stop myself from buying them. Soulblight could use new Graveguard, but otherwise they're in a pretty good place rn! I could see Graveguard being a Warcry thing actually! Though Undead in warhammer are pretty open-ended narratively; maybe we get a fishman vampire dynasty to steal Idoneth souls Delves are in a weird place, because I'd expect Malerion's get to step on their toes a bit like Lumineth, but iirc Delves are not set to be a major player in TOW (at least at launch). I feel like the Ogor range has actually aged extremely gracefully, and I didn't really understand some people's desire for new kits for 'em. But those new gorgers were way too cool; go do the whole range now! That, or give them a meaningful narrative beat and have a whole new wave of stuff; though I'm unsure what they're really "missing" at the moment James Workshop would have to release something objectively terrible model-wise for me to not be hyped for Chaos Duardin... and even if it was horribad ngl I'd probably still dig it.

Sick!! Make sure to post pictures! If you don't already own a Hobby Saw it would be a rock-solid investment for that project; the X-Acto brand one was less than $10 on Amazon when I'd checked this week and it comes with a spare blade! (just bought a new one myself) Having built three theridons recently, no force on this planet could make me try to cut their thicc selves in half with anything less!

That's cool! Actually exactly what I was picturing; I'd be excited to see Old World resin kits pop up in my LGS Also the concept of a new boxed set is interesting; could be AoS 4! Idk how that weight compares to other starter sets, but it is almost double the weight of the other box which is intriguing: I was thinking it could be a new army box or Warcry expansion, but that additional weight could absolutely "just" be a packed-in book

Looking at this, I notice 21 pallets of resin figures heading to the US... Haven't been to a GW store since FW and GW sites merged, but is this new? Could be signalling that resin kits may be in stores soon! Last I recall, most anything not-plastic was online only(?) Being able to pick up a resin kit while im in a GW store would honestly be what got me to make some impulse purchases. Lots of the new and newly-returning fantasy stuff is gorgeous and I'd be hard pressed to pass by the beautiful FW ork battle standard bearer even if I have no gaming use for him rn

The "boiler" playstyle reminds me of some of the mechanics the faction had in the Tamurkhan book iirc; K'daii could burn out and I think the iron daemon had a similar mechanic(?) That is why Astragoth needed the machine-legs! 100%: he was too stubborn to give up his position at the head of the table so he got the frame built for him! I think his arms may also had started to calcify but I'm forgetting. I keep having to stop myself from finding/converting bull centaurs lol: I'm trying so hard to be patient for eventual plastics! I'll second the suggestion that Ogroids may be a better person-half, though! Biomechanical centaurs would be really cool! I'd wager he is completely done for. The "favored headsman of Hashut" seemed like it was more intended for the Old World, but maybe he's just another character like Alwach the Drowner: despite there being like eight bigger-than-earth sized planets, there really is one dude in particular who is best at drowning people

A couple of semi-vague rumors on this site have pointed to Beastmen getting moved to The Old World; if they're getting fully shifted to the new-old setting, they'll be back in stock "soon" most likely with square bases in the box and new boxart! The rumor essentially said "beastmen are over in Age of Sigmar, they're going to be in The Old World instead" The rumor didn't say whether that deletion was the end of chaotic animal-human hybrids in AoS as a playable army, but it also didn't say the beasts were 100% getting a reboot faction in the same vein as lumineth. Glancing at the "shopping" tab on google for "beasts of chaos," there does seem to be some stock still around for the goatmen! Google Shopping is a bit hit and miss, but if you're wanting goats they're out there! just not on the GW site. If the future of the faction in AoS is critically important to your decision now, it may be best to pause for a bit to see where they're headed! If your main goal is to just build some sick goatmen, I would never discourage someone from pursuing an exciting creative endeavor!

I'm with you in that the "weirdo" mono-god beastmen are my favorites. Similarly, I like that Slaanesh-aligned beasts not only instinctually horde wealth/gems/baubles and act in slanneshi deprieved excess but also hate themselves for it. The idea that beastmen appreciate art and craftsmenship but then also hate themselves for doing so is, similar to the more martial khorne beasts, a wrinkle that Chaos sometimes lacks these days. AoS has plenty of space to add a paragraph or two of "some knights become so obsessed with their skills/code of marital ethic that they fall to Khorne." Its an interesting wrinkle that allows for way more interpretations of Khorne's themes than "barbarian." A host of "normal" knights could also reasonably be khorne worshippers! GW will have to tear the Realm of Chaos books out of my cold dead brain: I think Chaos being something "innocent, but taken to an extreme" is now mostly Slaanesh's thing, but I like the idea that a wizard with an obsession could tumble into Tzeentch out of pure academic curiosity. I think the other three still have some shades of grey, but Khorne could be way more than one-note. I think the bit there Khul fails in ascending because he has to accept this 1v1 challenge is as close as I can recall AoS getting with it in a big way. The Neferata book also was interesting, but they were definitely barbarians I'd love to see a diverse kit that makes all sorts of weirdos: some head and torso/leg options that arent goats would do a lot of work to make them pop off!

Those are incredible! I'd be super excited if we got anything half that cool. I'm with you that Morghur and the Gavespawn are the most exciting direction, for me, to take Beastmen in. I've always felt like Morghur and his narrative was one of the more/most unique parts of Beastmen in Warhammer compared to other settings

I think that'd make sense! Anyone know when/if the rest of Dawnbringers will drop? The new Khanite character was for the 5th book, yeah? Curious to see if they go for five or six: I felt like Broken Realms could have used one last book about Alarielle and the big Life spell she did and I'm hoping Dawnbringers has more of like a conclusion conclusion instead, even if there's an epilogue Rereading End Times: Nagash right now, and it's cool how you can see the Ossiarch and new Deathrattle take shape in some of the art! In particular, the image of the army and flying Black Pyramid after Nagash spanks Khemri. The mounted guy's armor looks like a Bonereaper and the skeletons on the next page look like the Cursed City guys. Always fun when you can pick out the seeds of cool ideas; hoping Dawnbringers does something similar for another faction or two!

You and I are on the exact same page! I bought multiple editions of the same WHF army book because each book was just about entirely different even just ignoring the rules! Man I'm always editing after I proofread my post can't believe I missed that lol; my brain was still on videogame-price Actually yeah I don't have full armies of Kharadron, O&G, or Ghouls yet but I've got a fistful of 'em and yeah I've got like 2k+ points of almost all the rest of that stuff listed! I care about the book cycle because I like playing with the up-to-date rules when I can (so I can keep abreast to discussion happening online) and, even ignoring matched play, i really like everything in the 10+ little narrative books they've released and they sometimes directly reference the core rules. I think I've swerved the app on principal without looking too much into it: I think I was initially grossed out by the fact that they shaved those warscrolls off their site to sell them in an app: tabletop gaming is a way for me to avoid screens, so I tend to want anything relevant on paper. I don't think I'd realized that the basic warscrolls were in there! That does a lot to deflate the issue! However, even if I only had 4 forces instead of a potential 10, that's still $200 an edition just for whatever new stuff gets added. Outside of the occasional videogame, movie, or camping, miniatures and miniatures games are my primary interest and hobby! I do have a silly investment in GW at this point, but I can also justify that investment as a physical hobby activity that brings me joy. I was so crestfallen the first time I opened a $50 book and realized I'd read most of it already! But the warscrolls being free online does mitigate a big percentage of the issue for sure, and I do appreciate you pointing it out!

Eventually, I'd like to own a "combined forces" army for each of the four Grand Alliances. Minimum, that's $200 an edition right now in only books so I can be up-to-date. In reality, my Free City is Sylvaneth + Kharadron + Cities, so that's three books. My Undead force is currently Soulblight + Nighthaunt and a handful of Ghouls, so another three books. Chaos is Slaves + Chaos Duardin + stuff from Orruks. Another three. I'd like my grots to have some orruk friends, so that'll be two for them. If I wanted to roll into 4.0, able to use all the models in my collection, that's 10 books. $500 in only battletomes just to use my GW toys in the GW game. That isn't even mentioning the Seasons of War, Dawnbringers, or Broken Realms type books that I always pick up bc I love them, usually another $50 a book. For now. Frostgrave is cool: it has had one new edition to tighten up the rules, and all the shovelfuls of new stuff is across a bunch of cool, thematic, expansion books. I'd love that for Warhammer! Really, if they went back to free get-you-by rules for the core game and free warscrolls, I'd happily buy all the other books they'd release. Expansions, campaigns, Storm of Magic, Battle in the Badlands, narrative books, arcane journals, etc etc etc! I'd buy it all! But, like, I can't even often justify $50 or $60 on a new 200+ hour videogame with how often things go on sale: how can I justify $60 for an update (that will immediately get an FAQ) and like maybe three new pages of text and a new piece of art or two? $50 that'll expire very soon? If they want to sell a bunch of books, make some creative stuff up and stick to the same solid core ruleset for like a decade! If they want to sell a ton of toys but update the game constantly, look to OnePageRules for a really solid template to build off of! I'd like to see GW iterate a bit: AoS 1.0 felt like something new, but it turned out to be a stopgap to get AoS to the 40k book cycle

How else are they supposed to sell every army a new book again? With Anvil of Apotheosis on the outs after 2.0, I wouldn't be surprised if Path to Glory got dropped for something else I know GW wants an always-updating/evolving game, but ngl I'd love to see the core rules stay the same for awhile and them find other ways to iterate the game: buying the same books regularly turns me off compared to most any other tabletop games

Fwiw, they're pretty good at being "Kroot Hounds" ngl; I don't really know what else they could reasonably look like? Looking at 'em again, are these kroots who have eaten so many dogs that they've become dog-like? Isn't that a thing for that species? Like winged Kroot and such? Bc they almost look like they're running on all fours; with wrist guards on even? They could actually be combined with Clanrats to make some nice looking Wolf-rats tbh! Just need the heads and tails from em: could be a good use of parts for anyone rocking any ape-rats that get updated I agree! They both look sort of useless like they're "barely animated" (something I traditionally associate with WH zombies instead) but simultaneously "too armored" for "basic skellies;" I actually stocked up on grave guard assuming the new Deathrattle were going to replace both kits. I felt like "all of them moving forward as automatons" gets across the idea that, functionally, the big squad of them is "one weapon" for a vampire or necromancer to wield. It also makes them look not-smart: walking lockstep for big huge Chaos Warriors looks like "ah man I'm done for" but a bunch of skeletons read as "controlled" or "mindless" to me. Rereading the End Times, it's well in line with how Skeletons are often described even in AoS! Don't really love the 8ft tall marionette vibe; one of the very few refresh kits I'm not a huge fan of

Could be wrong, but I'm fairly sure those lil' bugs are copied and pasted across all the new models that have "lil bugs" on 'em

Omg yesss!!!! Stuff like that, with just a few optional components to make it seem at home in a few distinctive clans, would be so beyond cool. I think blurring the lines could do a ton of good, and it's in line with the new short story that featured the verminlord telling those engineers to work together. Who is to say he didn't pop up and tell some pestilines guy to pack up the toxic smoke grenade launcher he's been cooking up and head their way?