Gistradagis

Makes sense if it ends up being true that most factions are getting points reductions to get more models and such. If this is true, though, I'd hope for an even bigger reduction, because the Glottkin feels so overcosted to me.

Cuz other factions can take them, but they don't admit anyone in their ranks. I guess?

Today's article about the GHB in the Community website. It reads: "A quick note for users of Azyr! We’ll be updating your Warhammer Age of Sigmar app with the new points as soon as we can, but there’ll be a small delay this year as our brave datasmiths put the finishing touches on the Warhammer 40,000 app. We’ll keep you posted, but hang tight – if you’re looking to write up-to-date lists in the meantime, crack out the pen and paper and the Pitched Battle profiles booklet!"

Quite so, considering they've said that due to 9th the updated points will come late to Azyr. But oh man, I do wish there's heroes joining units. Hero-sniping is getting really scary in AoS.

Oof. So the Harbinger of Decay is even less resilient than before, yay for us and for the age of hero-sniping that's coming. Btw, where are you seeing the leaks?

I think we shouldn't keep our hopes up for the point changes in the GHB. If the leaks are to be believed, then most factions are getting point reductions, which in a competitive game means that when everyone gets a buff, no one does (except against Seraphon and Lumineth I guess, since I doubt they'll be there). Regarding our current situation, I definitely agree with the general sentiment. We used to have 2 viable lists: 3x GuO + plaguebearers, and Blight Cyst mortals. With the recent change in meta that favours magic armies completely shutting down the opponent's hero phase, I'd say we can call the first list as dead and buried. So we're left with our mortals list, which is super inefficient points-wise (not only are BKs expensive, so are all of their battalions), and will usually only work with a Blight Cyst and nothing else. And let's not talk about how 80% of our battletome literally is so bad it sees 0 use. We're a faction with around 16-20 unique heroes (not counting general Chaos ones), but around 3-4 see play. Same with our units. So until we get an update (please soon...), we're sort of a one trick pony. To be fair, we still soooort of work; I've won a number of games with my Rotbringer lists, although I fear this list might follow the other's fate as hero-sniping is gaining prevalence now. Lumineth will snipe our Harbinger, Seraphon and other magic armies will destroy him with MWs (even with our good anti-spell defence on him), etc. So, yeah, fingers crossed that we don't have to wait half a year or more for an update.

Ah sorry, for some reason I thought the Endless Gift was the Command Trait from the sub-allegiance. Horticulous might not be a great substitute, cuz you already have a bunch of heroes.

Well, if those are the units you have, that's what you gotta play with. A couple things I'd recommend are: Plaguebearers in a unit of 20 and another of 10. A single of 30 is just unwieldy, and you only need them to screen and absorb charges (with the Munificient Wanderers CP to deal D3 MWs if a demon gets charged). The GuO and Poxbringer should always stay slightly behind the front line, buffing and casting spells. Don't know which ones you are picking, but I'd recommend giving the Favoured Poxes to the Poxbringer (debuff the enemy's key piece and just sit still, close enough to let plaguebearers re-roll saves), and Glorious Afflictions to the GuO. Speaking of the GuO, you want to have a Bileblade and Doomsday Bell, to make your army somewhat faster (get to the objecties you need, then stay put). Then just keep casting your chosen spell and arcane bolt, or mystic shield on some Blightkings. Speaking plain and fair, Plague Drones and Nurglings are terrible. They'll either be a minor nuisance, or just do nothing at all. So... you invest on being a nuisance. Nurglings can "deep-strike"... sort of. You must come out on your first turn, and in cover. Still, that allows you to sit on some objectives, or close to them, for some sneaky points. Conversely, you could make them pop somewhere in the enemy's deployment zone to start getting those 3 Contagion points. The Drones should be around the front lines, ready to intercept smth with their decent movement range or simply limit the space for the enemy to charge you. Something good here is that they are multi-wounds, so you can have them tank with their save and Disgustingly Resilient, then with the GuO cast Plague Wind and heal them while also dishing out some MWs to the Orruks. No idea what's your second artefact, since your list doesn't say, but I'd recomend the Witherstave on the GuO or Poxbringer. Sit behind the frontlines and give all enemy units within 12" a permanent "re-roll hit rolls of 6." Summon as appropriate. Either to reinforce your frontline, or to threaten objectives.

Honestly, I think we're being too optimistic here. After the StD update, practically no one used Chaos Knights, and Chaos Warriors were usually in some lists because we have no other real option for an anvil (yes, Marauders have similar "total wounds" but don't resist MWs or re-roll saves) even if they themselves aren't that good, and yet the FAQ not only didn't change them but made Warriors worse (could no longer mix weapons). Fingers crossed this summer we see points reduction across the board in the General's for StD, but I'm not gonna keep my hopes up. If we like how StD generally plays, I'd say to keep looking for ways to make their current playstyle more efficient because help might not be on its way.

Fair enough. I mostly used it in a somewhat-fluff list combining Nurgle and Pestilents, and I just really like the Glottkin, despite how horribly priced it is. I'd say that its damage problem is one mostly shared by the Nurgle units in general, their age truly shows. Most units doing stuff on 3+/4+, usually with low attacks and low/no rend.

If you take into account the full points of all, then you need to add the damage a Glottkin and Plague Priest on Censer will do, plus the magic and especial affects. Meaning, they'll do a lot more damage than Marauders. If, by some miracle, you have enough space to utilize the classic double line of Marauders with all three units, you'll get like 60-80 attacks, damaging on 3+, 4+, rend 1, damage 1, no especial effects or Mortal Wounds whatsoever.

You can sort of make it work with the Glottkin and a Priest on Plague Furnace. You give them +1 attacks command, then the prayer for +1 attacks or re-roll wounds, then charging for +1 attacks yet again, so you go up to 5 attacks for each model, using the weapon profile for 2" reach to fight at like 3 rows, doing mortal wounds on 6+ hitting (blades of putrefaction) and 6 on wounds (the plague monks themselves). You can easily go over 100 wounds with a unit of 40 plague monks, practically obliterating all you found in a combination of MWs and stray shots. This is way better than the straight bomb of Marauders, but the difference is Marauders will "always" make their charge and actually have some rend (in a well-sized unit).

Man, saw that list, and I'm half-tempted to run it. It looks fun but, at the same time, like you'll live or die by spells and MWs, nothing else.

Ofc. The only thing they can't get is the general's trait and artefact cuz, you know, named characters. But the abilities are for all the units who fit the requirements (such as being a daemon in a list that you've made one of the daemon sub-allegiances).

I see, thanks. Definitely didn't make sense either way as I mentioned in the edit, since you'd go in a crazy combo of infinite MWs, but it's good to have confirmation haha.

That's why I talked about legal conversions. If you play casual games/tourneys, then you can do pretty much whatever you want. If you play anything GW-related, you have to follow their rules.

Covering the base is actually the least important part. If you want a legal conversion, the new model needs to maintain a similar physical outline/profile for stuff such as LoS. That's the part you need to be particularly certain of.

I'm pretty sure the Karkadrak is way smaller than the Warshrine's "chasis." Also, the Chaos Lord on Karkadrak has a smaller base, too (90mm overall vs the 120x92mm of the warshrine).

Been looking through the forum and Google and, while some discussion of combining these two endless spells exist, it's always about whether the MWs are inflicted on the first or second portal, and I'm fairly certain it's on the former. My question, however, is as follows: Predatory endless spells are moved after setting them up. Now, the wording on the Spellportal clearly states that, if an endless spell ends within 6" of one side, you can take it and set it up on the other side. So, if you do this with the Pendulum, does this new set up mean you technically get another fresh move? Since you are setting up the endless spell, not moving it? Aethervoid Pendulum - Slicing into Reality: When this model is set up, the player who set it up can immediately make a move with it. Umbral Spellportal - Arcane Passage: If a predatory endless spell finishes a move within 6" of an Umbral Spellportal model, remove it from the battlefield and set it up again anywhere within 6" of the other Umbral Spellportal model from this endless spell. Edit: Thinking about it, RAW this makes full sense, but RAI it's ridiculous since it opens up a combo of infinite MWs, so I'm gonna guess it's a no can do.

Marauders. Also, DPs do have great damage potential, but you have to use them together with other units (otherwise they'll get surrounded and destroyed) or use their great movement to go for something far in the back. You could give Chosen a chance, too. While they need some support (they are paper-thin), they can dish some good damage, on top of some mortal wounds.

Marauders are soooooooooo good, though.

Oh, fair enough. Although, with the Khorne mark, you already reroll 1s on Hit and almost all your weapons Wound on 2+, so I feel like it's not that important to further improve his stats. The Khorne Daemon Prince also has his CP ability, which is kinda bonkers (18" bubble that reduces to 1/2 run and charge rolls for enemy units until your next hero phase), and with the Sword of Judgement you can smite heroes in a single turn while the Chaos Lord on Karkadrak obliterates units of chaff. I already count on having the Chaos Lord on Karkadrak be the one in the battalion, so fighting twice in my turn. Meanwhile, the DP will either stop the enemy with his CP or fly over enemy lines, charge a support hero and destroy it with a single attack (4 attacks, each 5+ thanks to charging is D6+2 mortal wounds).

Eternal Warrior? Do you mean the Eternal Vendetta trait? Or what is that?

You can give the trait to anyone, but if you make a DP your general, his aura goes from 12" to 18" and he gets a FNP of 5+. I personally like either Bolstered by Hate (making the DP 10 wounds on his 3+ save and the 5+ FNP), or Paragon of Ruin (D3 units at the beginning of the first round, before the first turn, get to move 5").

I've found it to be slightly too random to be of real use. It has some good effects, but it's such a 50/50 deal, coupled with underwhelming attacks (if only you could give it a Khorne mark or smth...) and alright stats (12 wounds on 4+ with a base that large, it's easy to get surrounded and obliterated), that I usually don't recommend it. It's a whole bet of its own. Some games it might do a lot of wounds and mortal wounds, and resist long enough to be a threat. In other games, it'll be 170 wasted points. So, up to you. It's not inviable, but it's not a safe choice either. What faction is that, though. Ravagers? Is it worth it with just two mortal heroes? I actually have a very similar list, but I run it in Despoilers and have no Mindstealer, 10 Warriors instead of 15, the Knights broken into two units of 5, and a Daemon Prince of Khorne as general. Making it an army from Ulgu, I'm planning on giving the Daemon Prince the Sword of Judgement and the Chaos Lord on Karkadrak the Dimensional Blade (Hexed Battle-axe with rend 3, used twice with the battalion? Yes plz).